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"witch hunt against ... anarchists" in washington state
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"witch hunt against ... anarchists" in washington state

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However, we suspected that this was not really about broken windows. As if they had taken pointers from Orwell’s 1984, they took books, artwork and other various literature as “evidence” as well as many other personal belongings even though they seemed to know that nobody there was even in Seattle on May Day. While we know that knowledge is powerful, we suspected that nobody used rolled up copies of the Stumptown Wobbly to commit property damage. We saw this for what it was. They are trying to investigate anarchists and persecute them for their beliefs. This is a fishing expedition. This is a witch hunt. Since then, thanks to a Freedom of Information Act request, we have learned that this Grand jury was convened on March 2nd, 2012, two months before the May Day vandalism even took place…


http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/lea...hist/6448/

The link at the bottom goes here: http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/3-y...ists/6467/
From the second article:

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Here are 3 reasons you should support these grand jury resisters:

This is from a FBI training guide about anarchist "terrorists." "Non-cooperative" is one of the only things they got right.

1) They have not committed any crime. Plante, Duran, and Olejnik were not subpoenaed to the grand jury because they are being tied to a crime, they were subpoenaed with the hopes that they could be intimidated into providing information on others. I’ve seen some people say things like, ”if they didn’t have information about a crime, they wouldn’t have been subpoenaed.” That’s simply untrue. In the past, activists have been subpoenaed to grand juries because they are friends with a “target,” or have dated someone under investigation, or just had their name appear in an address book or email list.

2) This is part of the on-going demonization of anarchists, and dissent. From the FBI entrapment plot targeting Occupy Cleveland to FBI training materials describing anarchists as “criminal seeking an ideology,” this is a crackdown not on specific criminal activity but on an entire belief system.


I want to add here, that the mainstream left and right have each been complicit in this, with the anarchist "dirty word" being used by the right to describe Occupy Wallstreet (which is still going on, by the way) and with people like the Liberal Library using "anarchistic" to describe the right wing's opposition to secular (instead of religious or other tyrannical) forms of government.  Of course anarchism is opposition to tyrannical government, whether religious or secular, so someone who wants to impose a secular or religious tyranny in place of the current government is by definition not an anarchist.  

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3) Today’s response will shape what happens tomorrow. I mean this in two ways. First, the resistance of these grand jurors, and the support of their communities, may affect how long they are imprisoned and whether others are subpoenaed. Grand jury resisters are technically only allowed to be imprisoned if the jail time will be an incentive for them to cooperate. If it’s clear that they will not cooperate, under any circumstances, it puts their attorneys in a much better position to fight for their release. And it also sends a clear message to prosecutors that further attempts to intimidate activists will also fail.


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10-13-2012 07:42 AM
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Gareth
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RE: "witch hunt against ... anarchists" in washington state

Occupy wallstreet are in no way anarchists, for one thing an anarchist wouldn't demand the government take more money from people.




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10-15-2012 02:21 AM
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Gareth
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RE: "witch hunt against ... anarchists" in washington state

Oh, and if someone's accused of destroying government property then i'd argue that the presence of anarchist beliefs is in fact quite relevant.
You can of course hold such beliefs but only act on them peacefully, but it's not unreasonable to suggest that someone who is anti-government is more likely to use violence against government property than someone who is pro-government.




“Lanie, I’m going to print more printers. Lots more printers. One for everyone. That’s worth going to jail for. That’s worth anything.” - Printcrime by Cory Doctrow
10-15-2012 02:23 AM
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marioluvsfries
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RE: "witch hunt against ... anarchists" in washington state

Wait ... Occupy WallStreet is demanding that the Government take more money from it's people ? I though it had to do with fighting corruption in politics ... :/ Don't they have a bunch of hackervist's working for them ?

10-15-2012 02:43 AM
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d_olson27
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RE: "witch hunt against ... anarchists" in washington state

marioluvsfries Wrote:
Wait ... Occupy WallStreet is demanding that the Government take more money from it's people ? I though it had to do with fighting corruption in politics ... :/ Don't they have a bunch of hackervist's working for them ?


Yes, indeed. Tax increases on the wealthy to get them to pay their fair share (at least as much of a percent of their income as average working people) is, in fact, demanding that the government take more money from people.


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10-15-2012 02:45 AM
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Gareth
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RE: "witch hunt against ... anarchists" in washington state

marioluvsfries Wrote:
Wait ... Occupy WallStreet is demanding that the Government take more money from it's people ? I though it had to do with fighting corruption in politics ... :/ Don't they have a bunch of hackervist's working for them ?


They openly called for higher taxation.

But the whole "occupy" movement in general is a mish-mash of incoherent ideologies and goals.




“Lanie, I’m going to print more printers. Lots more printers. One for everyone. That’s worth going to jail for. That’s worth anything.” - Printcrime by Cory Doctrow
10-15-2012 02:45 AM
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RE: "witch hunt against ... anarchists" in washington state

d_olson27 Wrote:

marioluvsfries Wrote:
Wait ... Occupy WallStreet is demanding that the Government take more money from it's people ? I though it had to do with fighting corruption in politics ... :/ Don't they have a bunch of hackervist's working for them ?


Yes, indeed. Tax increases on the wealthy to get them to pay their fair share (at least as much of a percent of their income as average working people) is, in fact, demanding that the government take more money from people.


One thing they protested about was the lower tax rates on dividend payments, which are in fact taxed twice - corporate tax and then dividend tax.

Hilariously, they also protested about bank bailouts too, which while being perhaps the only point I agreed with them on also makes them hypocrites as such bailouts were dependent on tax funding.




“Lanie, I’m going to print more printers. Lots more printers. One for everyone. That’s worth going to jail for. That’s worth anything.” - Printcrime by Cory Doctrow
10-15-2012 02:47 AM
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Gareth
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RE: "witch hunt against ... anarchists" in washington state

Oh, and here's raw numbers:
http://sphotos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak...2986_n.jpg

69% of US tax revenue comes from those earn above $100k a year - and the rich should be paying more?




“Lanie, I’m going to print more printers. Lots more printers. One for everyone. That’s worth going to jail for. That’s worth anything.” - Printcrime by Cory Doctrow
10-15-2012 02:48 AM
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d_olson27
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RE: "witch hunt against ... anarchists" in washington state

Gareth Wrote:
One thing they protested about was the lower tax rates on dividend payments, which are in fact taxed twice - corporate tax and then dividend tax.


I could use the same argument to say that taxes shouldn't get taken out of my paycheck, because my employer already paid taxes on that money before giving it to me.


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10-15-2012 02:53 AM
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d_olson27
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RE: "witch hunt against ... anarchists" in washington state

Gareth Wrote:
Oh, and here's raw numbers:
http://sphotos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak...2986_n.jpg

69% of US tax revenue comes from those earn above $100k a year - and the rich should be paying more?


The average tax rate on a working person in the United States is 34%. The maximum tax rate that a person who makes all of their income from dividend payments is 12%. Yes, I think they should be paying more.


Friends will let you be who you are. Best friends will never let you forget it. I'm just trying to be everyone's best friend.
10-15-2012 02:55 AM
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Gareth
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RE: "witch hunt against ... anarchists" in washington state

d_olson27 Wrote:

Gareth Wrote:
Oh, and here's raw numbers:
http://sphotos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak...2986_n.jpg

69% of US tax revenue comes from those earn above $100k a year - and the rich should be paying more?


The average tax rate on a working person in the United States is 34%. The maximum tax rate that a person who makes all of their income from dividend payments is 12%. Yes, I think they should be paying more.


Except that because it's a higher income, they are paying more already. Look at the overall volume rather than just the % rate.




“Lanie, I’m going to print more printers. Lots more printers. One for everyone. That’s worth going to jail for. That’s worth anything.” - Printcrime by Cory Doctrow
10-15-2012 02:59 AM
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Post: #12
RE: "witch hunt against ... anarchists" in washington state

d_olson27 Wrote:

Gareth Wrote:
One thing they protested about was the lower tax rates on dividend payments, which are in fact taxed twice - corporate tax and then dividend tax.


I could use the same argument to say that taxes shouldn't get taken out of my paycheck, because my employer already paid taxes on that money before giving it to me.


Not quite - dividend payments are paid from property (stock) that you own.

Imagine you own a shop, you make sales and your profits are taxed, and then on top of that when you draw those profits out they're taxed again. The overall effective tax rate can therefore work out to be much higher.




“Lanie, I’m going to print more printers. Lots more printers. One for everyone. That’s worth going to jail for. That’s worth anything.” - Printcrime by Cory Doctrow
10-15-2012 03:01 AM
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d_olson27
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RE: "witch hunt against ... anarchists" in washington state

Gareth Wrote:

d_olson27 Wrote:

Gareth Wrote:
Oh, and here's raw numbers:
http://sphotos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak...2986_n.jpg

69% of US tax revenue comes from those earn above $100k a year - and the rich should be paying more?


The average tax rate on a working person in the United States is 34%. The maximum tax rate that a person who makes all of their income from dividend payments is 12%. Yes, I think they should be paying more.


Except that because it's a higher income, they are paying more already. Look at the overall volume rather than just the % rate.


It's supposed to be higher. That's how the tax code is designed. If I get a higher paycheck than normal, the dollar amount that I pay in taxes also goes up.

Most wealthy people not only make more money, but also make more use of the commons while making that money. Considering that, I think it's fair to expect them to pay more in taxes.

Besides, looking at the overall volume rather than the percent is a classic strawman argument designed to make the upper class tax rate look like class warfare, when in reality, it's just math.


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10-15-2012 03:06 AM
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d_olson27
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RE: "witch hunt against ... anarchists" in washington state

Gareth Wrote:

d_olson27 Wrote:

Gareth Wrote:
One thing they protested about was the lower tax rates on dividend payments, which are in fact taxed twice - corporate tax and then dividend tax.


I could use the same argument to say that taxes shouldn't get taken out of my paycheck, because my employer already paid taxes on that money before giving it to me.


Not quite - dividend payments are paid from property (stock) that you own.

Imagine you own a shop, you make sales and your profits are taxed, and then on top of that when you draw those profits out they're taxed again. The overall effective tax rate can therefore work out to be much higher.


In other words, your business is taxed, and then your personal income is taxed.


Friends will let you be who you are. Best friends will never let you forget it. I'm just trying to be everyone's best friend.
10-15-2012 03:07 AM
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Gareth
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RE: "witch hunt against ... anarchists" in washington state

As an example, if your corporation makes $100k the tax rate on that corporation is "$13,750 + 34% Of the amount over 75,000"
So that's $52,250.0

Then qualified dividend tax is 15% - leaving $44,412.50

The effective tax rate is thus 55.58%




“Lanie, I’m going to print more printers. Lots more printers. One for everyone. That’s worth going to jail for. That’s worth anything.” - Printcrime by Cory Doctrow
10-15-2012 03:10 AM
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