Oh lordy, back to the usual standard of thing.

Duke. That is plainly not what I said, if you read it again carefully. The 'label' would still be autism, and quite probably something like the proposed DSM V labelling. However, the coding would be available as an easy method of communicating in a transferable method the types of co-morbids that people have, if any, and their other characteristics. That way there is an easy method of understanding the severity or otherwise of a person's own particular autism in detail. And autism is only understandable in detail, as each autist is as different from another as you would find in the general population.

But more, far more, importantly, it allows us to communicate to people that we are all humans, and that some of the characteristics in people labelled as autistic will also be found in people who do not have that label and would not get it. My nephew has several traits, but would not be diagnosed in a million years in his current state. Autism is just a part of the human spectrum, and it is the lack of knowledge about the blurred boundaries that causes us so much difficulty. This method would allow us to communicate that, and force the rest of the world to acknowledge it. We need to shift the terms of the argument if we are to combat the general prejudices.

Hopefully, it would allow 'ordinary' people to recognise that they have traits that autists do, but they may only have one. Therefore we are not removed from them on a classification level. This would be particularly relevant, if ... and it is a big if ... Simon Baron Cohen's notion of autism being ultramaleness was shown to be accurate. Men are much less able to deal with constant noise than women. Women are the main caregivers and are far less likely to be driven demented by a constantly crying baby. Autists are very often unable to deal with a lot of noise ... so ... just a hyper manifestation of an otherwise 'normal' human trait? I don't know, but the ability to connect us back to the generality of the population is restored.

Fnord. Unfortunately you have displayed all your usual capabilities for debate. Who suggested a barcode on your forehead? That's just silly and not worthy of serious address.

However, there is no way that this method of communicating a particular person's individual manifestation of autism is going to identify them. That is plainly ridiculous. It is not going to 'identify' you any more than having a hairy face identifies you as a man. And that IS tatooed across your foreh ... chin. We only have the whole notion of autism because it causes us some difficulties at times, or to put it another way, we are different in sufficient respects that it causes a problem for other people which becomes a problem for us by default. When such a situation arises this is just an easy method of communicating the characteristic set.

And, now that I think about it, there is no reason that a minus number could not be used to indicate hyperability in some areas. If communication was coded T, and music was 4th of 9 possibilities ... T4-8 would be a highly artistic and musically able person. Likewise if mathematics was 3rd of 9 possibilities ... T3-4 would be a person with very good mathematical possibilities bordering on savantism perhaps.

This would not be a label to be tatooed. It would not be one's new name. It would be a very simple method of saying what one's strengths and weaknesses are, and highlight that because a person is on the autistic part of the human spectrum, they are far from a write off. Seems logical, simple, and very useful to me.

Not only would it communicate one's abilities, it would also comunicate one's accomplishments to the extent that it shows an individual has been proven to be very good at a particular thing. And very often that is what employers want. So a person could be pretty deficient in terms of their ability to personally interact, and work in strong light, but they may well have a very good set of logical processes that help in the manufacture of particular equipment, for instance. Normally that person would not even get an interview because their light sensitivity and lack of eye contact and communication abilities would preclude them.

And remember. Accomplishments are things that have been achieved. But they need to be achieved first. Unfortunately in this chicken and egg situation, the chicken comes first, and it is the deficits which are first apprehended by the interlocutor. That needs to be changed and a greater openness to autists achieved.

As for you being you, and not Asperger's. Well, that is plainly wrong. You are both. Asperger's is just a label which indicates what sort of you you are. Whether or not you let it stand in your way is a different thing. Clearly you don't feel that you do. However, I would beg to differ.

i take it that aspergers is a 'subset' of autism - so dumping the aspergers label would be no different to dumping the christian names of the baron cohen tribe - no distinction any longer between simon and sasha - wouldnt it be fascinating for sasha to interview simon for his views on dumping the aspergers title - we wouldnt have an answer - but the journey would be interesting

When this happens, I'll just use my mental illness label more then. Asperger's Syndrome has more of a professional feel to it.

I want to say more, but it will get me cursed out, badgered, belittled, fussed at, and maybe banned if I say the things that are on my mind.

Hans Asperger's discoveries were different then Dr. Leo Kanner's (Dr. Pee-Wee Herman) discoveries. If they are linked, then good. Asperger's has German roots if I am getting my facts right. So I guess the APA wants to Americanize or want to put everything into one sum to make things easier. I guess they want to make jobs easier for Psych people and Neurologists.

Yawn... there are many different names for Physical Disabilities. I mean many. So why not many different names for forms of Autism. Why do we need PDD-NOS? If any label (or labels) should go, I say PDD-NOS and PDD should go. They never made sense to me. My crazy psych back during my teen years said I had PDD and Autism. Can't have both at the same time, it is either one or the other. He was so out of date on his findings anyways. Certain places (or hospitals) in Dade county don't consider Asperger's and just label the kid (or adult) as Autistic. That is how old school they old. Now with the scrapping of the label, we're going back to old school thinking.

I know nonesome of you guys don't like what I have posted in this thread (and or others like it). Well that is just on you. I believe in other stuff and things, but I rather not post them here. You guys don't know me in real life, so don't be too quick to judge me.

Its the samething!!!

Lizzy, What is proposed is that the category of Asperger's is to be removed, as well as LFA, HFA, PDD-NOS, and CDD and all other variants. Instead what there will be is Slight, Moderate and Severe, as far as I remember, though this seems to have vanished from the DSMV site. Thus there is not going to be a single diagnosis of autism, or at least, not a simple one. It will be .......... autism, according to whichever standard one is judged to meet.

The DSM-V site is still there! And it's open for suggestions until May 7 (new deadline!!!!)

Deep link to autism.

Yawn... I'm not even going to bother to prove that I am right/wrong anymore. I'll throw in the white towel and walk away.

Y'all win. I'm not even going to agree to disagree on this. I have more things on my mind, but I'll most likely get banned for saying them.

Bottom line, I just give up. >_<;

Oh.... sorry

Lizzy, I think you're being just a touch oversensitive.  No one is going to ban you for having a completely civilized conversation.  People can disagree without it being a big deal.

This post was last modified: 04-29-2010 03:16 AM by Ruby2010.

Yeah, I guess that would be the polite way of saying that.

True, but my views are a bit on the controversial side. Views that this site and Amanda Baggs would find shockingly elitist/separatist like. It's probably due to the way I was treated in the school system.

Now that I think about it, this scrapping will make it worst for Autistic students in the school system. They'll put "all" Autistics (Including Asperger's) in the same room. They'll expect them to learn. Shoot, I couldn't focus on my FCAT in 7th grade while the students in the class were screaming. They expected me to take the test while students to screaming and trying to touch me. >_<;

None of the school districts I've ever been in had separate classes for special needs students.  The special needs students just had one course period a day that was essentially study hall with the special ed coordinators.  The rest of the time they were in the mainstream classes.

Actually I was in special ed growing up and yes all kids went to the same room but we all had different needs. Most of them were normal but they had learning difficulties. They went to normal classes and mainstreamed special ed. So did I.
There was a girl with down syndrome in the special ed room and she was in it full time but went to a few normal classes like PE and cooking and art. Then there was another boy with DS and he was also stuck in the same room too. There was also a girl in a wheelchair and she was in special ed too full time but took cooking class. I am not sure what her learning difficulties were but based on the school work she be doing, I would guess she was also mentally retarded. But when she talked, she sounded normal. I never asked if she had MR or not.

Some kids did have aids full time such as these students who had DS and the girl in a wheel chair. I had an aid full time until my Junior year. But everyone else in special ed didn't.

But however, when I was six and seven I was placed in a special ed room full time with other kids and it messed me up. They didn't give me normal school work and they had me do the same work over and over. Plus everyone had different needs so they all had different rules. It was okay for one boy to have his own basketball and not share it and it was okay for him to shout out numbers as we count. It was okay for this one boy to run in the classroom with his pants pulled down but yet the rest of us weren't allowed to do it. It was okay for this one girl to scream when you touch her from behind but the rest of us weren't allowed to scream. I picked up on inappropriate behavior and acted like the other kids in my class. It was school behavior I thought so I did it there only. So it was like I had two different personalities. I would be myself at home but in school I was this low functioning girl. This was before there was inclusion. Back in those days they stuck kids with disabilities in one class. They put low functioning and high functioning ones together. It caused behavior problems and more issues in students because they pick up from each other how to act. Put autistic kids in one class, they act more autistic, the same thing happens with mental retardation and kids with behavior problems. Even normal kids do it except they call it peer pressure but they don't go copying special need kids. Even my husband didn't go copying them when he was in special ed full time. He was in one of those classes too. Not all special need kids copy other special need kids in their class because they know it's inappropriate behavior and they understand the kid doesn't know any better or he "can't help it." They don't think that is how you are supposed to act or think "Oh that behavior is okay to do."

That really depends on how much you care about other people's problems.

I see everyones point and I get what everyone means to a point...

Anyways... If I had acted out, they would had beaten me or yelled at me. But if the true Autistics did it, they let them act out. I had to be perfect or else I get beaten or yelled at. At one point, one teacher wanted to put me in an EH (Emotionally Handicap) class. No one knew I had Bipolar till I was 18 1/2 or 19 years old anyways. They blamed all my medically issues and neurological issues not related to Asperger's on the Autism.

Now that is what you call lazy doctors.

I will say this again, I don't agree on scrapping the labels. In fact, I agree to adding on to the labels. Autism is to vague anyways. We need to make it more clear and understandable. Organizations like Autism Speaks isn't going to help do that. Extremist like myself and others will be able to do that. If I ran for Governor for my state, I would put more funding into education, family services, Medicaid, and other things that are useful.

So yeah, Autism is way too vague diagnosis wise. We need a clearer diagnosis scale. I say scrap PDD and PDD-NOS. Those sound like dumping ground labels anyways. EH is a dumping ground label as well. You're either Autistic or Asperger's. If you can't fit into any of those. Then you just carry the gene then.