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Possibility of life having existed, or still existing, on Mars
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Lang
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RE: Possibility of life having existed, or still existing, on Mars
I think you're going to find life everywhere in the universe, that we are not "Special" and that abiogenesis is not such a difficult process in the early days of a planet like our earth.
Chris Christie is so fat, I was giving a presentation and he ate my pie charts.

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| 07-19-2009 03:48 PM |
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A True Monotheist
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RE: Possibility of life having existed, or still existing, on Mars
Now, intelligent life is a whole other matter. I believe that it probably exists. While I am skeptical about taking UFO abduction reports on any kind of face value, without critically assessing how it is that advanced aliens would somehow need our bodies for reproduction, and even be able to mate with us across species and planetary boundaries, I also believe that we are not limited to radio astronomy if we are talking about actual contact. Some kind of interstellar travel is possible. Wormholes are one possibility, or relativistic speeds making light-years seem like minutes to truly dedicated travelers another possibility. A third possibility might be a base or alien-terraformed planet in a near-by start system. (I supposed "terra"-formed would be a misnomer)
Now, whether the aliens would have the quasi-humanoid form that science fiction and UFO reports suggest is a whole other matter. It is possible that they may look as different from us as we do an anemone. A lot of arguments could go either way. Some might argue that the humanoid shape is the best adapted to technology. That is an argument that could be made. However, "best adapted" and actually existing are two different things. An "is" does not necessarily imply an "ought."
Yet, I doubt that such beings exist on Mars. I believe that, should life exist on Mars, such life would be profoundly limited to bacterial or some kind of primitive life. That is my honest opinion, although the Internet abounds with conspiracy and UFO websites claiming otherwise:
http://www.enterprisemission.com/
Personally, I choose to be more conservative.
A True Monotheist
Hillel says, "If I am not for myself, who will be for me? But if I am only for myself, who am I? If not now, when?" Ethics of the Fathers, 1:14
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| 07-20-2009 09:48 PM |
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micgrace
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RE: Possibility of life having existed, or still existing, on Mars
The problem of course, in determining if there is intelligent life out there, can they contact us? probably not.
I'm no astronomer person, This is pure conjecture for now, but lets say there is a hundred stars within a hundred light years that may have a "habitable" planet with intelligent beings on it. They vary in age from , say 1B to 5B of age. Our age is 2.5B. We have been transmitting stuff for say, 100 years, so whats the probability one of them could transmit to us? Say, 100 / (4B-2.5B) gives, 7 x 10^-8, so almost no chance whatsover. Effectively ZERO. So we would never know. So why bother trying to contact them, we would have to go there first.
Rule 1. Never, ever, give up (mind blanks excepted)
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| 07-21-2009 11:28 AM |
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Alison
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RE: Possibility of life having existed, or still existing, on Mars
We have been transmitting stuff for say, 100 years, so whats the probability one of them could transmit to us? Say, 100 / (4B-2.5B) gives, 7 x 10^-8, so almost no chance whatsover. Effectively ZERO. So we would never know. So why bother trying to contact them, we would have to go there first.
Further to that, what's to say that they'd even recognize radio waves as a form of communication? Their senses needn't be anything like ours. For example, if they have an insectile-type of sense, they could use pheromones as communication. Or something so exotic even my science-fictiony imagination can't imagine! They also may see and understand our communication attempts, but just couldn't be bothered socialising - the ultimate Aspie civilisation!
Alison
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| 07-21-2009 11:42 AM |
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micgrace
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RE: Possibility of life having existed, or still existing, on Mars
They, the advanced ones (if any) probably think we are too backward and don't bother with us. Like a primitive tribe or something. The rest can't anyway. Hence 100 years.
Rule 1. Never, ever, give up (mind blanks excepted)
Rule 2. Refer to rule 1.
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| 07-21-2009 11:54 AM |
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Patrice
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RE: Possibility of life having existed, or still existing, on Mars
There's a major problem in going to far away planets to find life. If you at speeds near the speed of light, it may only take a few years to get from one point to another but the rest of the world does not. The few years it took you to get there will actually be thousands of years for the rest of the world. That is based on Einstein's special relativity: T=To*1/(1-(v^2/c^2))^1/2
The stars you see everynight is how those stars looked millions of years ago. Some may no longer exist.
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| 07-21-2009 01:12 PM |
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A True Monotheist
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RE: Possibility of life having existed, or still existing, on Mars
There's a major problem in going to far away planets to find life. If you at speeds near the speed of light, it may only take a few years to get from one point to another but the rest of the world does not. The few years it took you to get there will actually be thousands of years for the rest of the world. That is based on Einstein's special relativity: T=To*1/(1-(v^2/c^2))^1/2
The stars you see everynight is how those stars looked millions of years ago. Some may no longer exist.
Precisely my point. They could travel that galaxy if they were willing to deal with the fact that hour for them could be a thousand years (approximate times of course) at high enough speeds. If they are no longer tied to one planet, this could be a possibility.
There was a science fiction story about a future human traveler who would go from colony of humans on one star system to another at relativistic speeds, each time only experiencing a few months of hybernation but with tens or hundreds of years passing in "normal" time. It was a sad story, but plausible.
A True Monotheist
Hillel says, "If I am not for myself, who will be for me? But if I am only for myself, who am I? If not now, when?" Ethics of the Fathers, 1:14
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| 07-21-2009 09:01 PM |
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A True Monotheist
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RE: Possibility of life having existed, or still existing, on Mars
There's a major problem in going to far away planets to find life. If you at speeds near the speed of light, it may only take a few years to get from one point to another but the rest of the world does not. The few years it took you to get there will actually be thousands of years for the rest of the world. That is based on Einstein's special relativity: T=To*1/(1-(v^2/c^2))^1/2
The stars you see everynight is how those stars looked millions of years ago. Some may no longer exist.
Precisely my point. They could travel that galaxy if they were willing to deal with the fact that hour for them could be a thousand years (approximate times of course) at high enough speeds. If they are no longer tied to one planet, this could be a possibility.
There was a science fiction story about a future human traveler who would go from colony of humans on one star system to another at relativistic speeds, each time only experiencing a few months of hybernation but with tens or hundreds of years passing in "normal" time. It was a sad story, but plausible.
Besides, with "evidence" like this, who needs science?

(Real picture of what is undoubtedly a rock formation)
A True Monotheist
Hillel says, "If I am not for myself, who will be for me? But if I am only for myself, who am I? If not now, when?" Ethics of the Fathers, 1:14
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| 07-29-2009 10:09 PM |
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A True Monotheist
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RE: Possibility of life having existed, or still existing, on Mars
Although a *real picture* from Mars, it is undoubtedly a rock formation and not Big Foot on Mars. It is an example of the "evidence" put forth by some that only discredits this whole discussion.
A True Monotheist
Hillel says, "If I am not for myself, who will be for me? But if I am only for myself, who am I? If not now, when?" Ethics of the Fathers, 1:14
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| 07-30-2009 12:49 AM |
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micgrace
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RE: Possibility of life having existed, or still existing, on Mars
Liquid water was spotted on Mars. Except it quickly disappears thanks to the low air pressure. Where there is water there is probably life although, I think the chances of kicking into a fossilized skeleton on Mars are pretty remote. But one never knows. (stupid keboard, one needs a hammer for the keys)
Rule 1. Never, ever, give up (mind blanks excepted)
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| 07-30-2009 04:05 AM |
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person3
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RE: Possibility of life having existed, or still existing, on Mars
To paraphrase "Calvin & Hobbes", "The surest sign of there being intelligent life in this universe is that it hasn't tried to contact humans."
"Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference.
The MARINES don't have that problem."
President Ronald Reagan - 1985
"So they've got us surrounded, good! Now we can fire in any direction, those b*****ds won't get away this time!"
CHESTY PULLER, USMC
"Come on, you sons of b*****! Do you want to live forever?"
GySgt. DANIEL DALY, USMC
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| 07-30-2009 04:52 AM |
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Alison
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RE: Possibility of life having existed, or still existing, on Mars
Liquid water was spotted on Mars. Except it quickly disappears thanks to the low air pressure. Where there is water there is probably life although, I think the chances of kicking into a fossilized skeleton on Mars are pretty remote. But one never knows. (stupid keboard, one needs a hammer for the keys)
I find it interesting that, of all the planets so far discovered, ours is the only one with freely available liquid water ie not locked up as ice deposits, underground, etc. And this is also the only planet so far discovered with life on it.
Not only that, but of the planets we've found so far orbiting other stars, all of them have seemed to be back-to-front to our solar systems way of doing things: the big gaseous planets are close in to their star, while the little rocky ones are far out and frozen solid.
So perhaps our planet is more special than we imagine. What a pity we aren't taking better care of it, in that case. There probably isn't one anywhere else that can support us.
Alison
To be ruled by tradition just means that you're letting yourself be outvoted by the dead.
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| 07-30-2009 06:38 AM |
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Patrice
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RE: Possibility of life having existed, or still existing, on Mars
Liquid water was spotted on Mars. Except it quickly disappears thanks to the low air pressure. Where there is water there is probably life although, I think the chances of kicking into a fossilized skeleton on Mars are pretty remote. But one never knows. (stupid keboard, one needs a hammer for the keys)
I find it interesting that, of all the planets so far discovered, ours is the only one with freely available liquid water ie not locked up as ice deposits, underground, etc. And this is also the only planet so far discovered with life on it.
Not only that, but of the planets we've found so far orbiting other stars, all of them have seemed to be back-to-front to our solar systems way of doing things: the big gaseous planets are close in to their star, while the little rocky ones are far out and frozen solid.
So perhaps our planet is more special than we imagine. What a pity we aren't taking better care of it, in that case. There probably isn't one anywhere else that can support us.
Alison
We've had our ice ages and there will be more to come too. Mars could simply be into one while ours isn't.
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| 07-30-2009 06:55 AM |
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micgrace
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RE: Possibility of life having existed, or still existing, on Mars
To paraphrase "Calvin & Hobbes", "The surest sign of there being intelligent life in this universe is that it hasn't tried to contact humans."
LOL. Why would they, our track record so far on this planet is apalling so I suppose we are in quarantine in case we poison other places.
Rule 1. Never, ever, give up (mind blanks excepted)
Rule 2. Refer to rule 1.
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| 07-30-2009 06:59 AM |
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A True Monotheist
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RE: Possibility of life having existed, or still existing, on Mars
To paraphrase "Calvin & Hobbes", "The surest sign of there being intelligent life in this universe is that it hasn't tried to contact humans."
LOL. Why would they, our track record so far on this planet is apalling so I suppose we are in quarantine in case we poison other places.
OK, well, I haven't ruled out the possibility that we might have been, or are being, visited. It is just that so many of the UFO abduction reports do not suggest extraterrestrials as such. ET's do not interbreed with humans. Not only would they have to cross a species barrier, but they would also cross a whole barrier of potentially different types of DNA. Even other primates cannot interbreed with us. No, UFO abduction accounts suggest other scenarios entirely. I agree with old Carl Sagan on that point, even if I do not agree with him that all sightings can be explained away as weather balloons or the planet Venus.
Yet, at the same time, we do not know that we are in quarantine. We do not know that we are limited to radio astronomy. Again, there is too much that we do not know to intelligently speculate. So, let us leave off with wonder, and the humility to know that we do not know:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLXQk5KVL...re=related
A True Monotheist
Hillel says, "If I am not for myself, who will be for me? But if I am only for myself, who am I? If not now, when?" Ethics of the Fathers, 1:14
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| 07-30-2009 08:17 AM |
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