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The cause of Asperger's : Evolution
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142857



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Post: #136
RE: The cause of Asperger's : Evolution

Ars Arcanum Wrote:
....we don't exactly have clean noses ourselves. i would like to point out that during world war two, one of us, the esteemed einstein, created the most dangerous thing on the planet in order to combat another one of us, hitler(yes, he was unfortunately an aspie. see wikipedia).

It was Einstein's general theory of relativity that made the idea of a nuclear weapon feasible. Einstein succesfully lobbied the US government to develop a nuclear weapon because of his fear that Hitler's Germany might be on the verge of developing such a weapon, and because of his knowledge of just how possible and how potentially devastating such a weapon was.

But Einstein himself had little to do with the actual development of the A-bomb.

Stalin's Soviet Union also developed the atomic bomb in the years following WWII. The Soviet Union, with Stalin at the helm, as the sole nuclear power? I think the consequences of that would be fairly obvious. Japan and Germany both had advanced nuclear weapons programs during WWII - we should also be thankful that neither of those powers became the first to develop nuclear weapons.

06-20-2010 08:27 AM
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Ars Arcanum



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Post: #137
RE: The cause of Asperger's : Evolution

perhaps my sources were faulty. but i'm pretty sure hitler was an aspie. no NT could pull something that big off so successfully. i'm not glorifying the holocaust, i'm just saying that NTs aren't nearly that efficient.

and as far as aspergers being an evolutionary step, i agree completely, although whether it's a step forwards, backwards, or sideways i can't say. although i doubt you would find an aspie stupid enough to charge out of an eleventh story window trying to prove it was shatterproof.

06-20-2010 04:21 PM
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Post: #138
RE: The cause of Asperger's : Evolution

Ars Arcanum Wrote:
perhaps my sources were faulty. but i'm pretty sure hitler was an aspie. no NT could pull something that big off so successfully. i'm not glorifying the holocaust, i'm just saying that NTs aren't nearly that efficient.


Congratulations, you win the "dumb post of the week" award.

06-20-2010 04:46 PM
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Ars Arcanum



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Post: #139
RE: The cause of Asperger's : Evolution

Pikajedi3 Wrote:

Ars Arcanum Wrote:
perhaps my sources were faulty. but i'm pretty sure hitler was an aspie. no NT could pull something that big off so successfully. i'm not glorifying the holocaust, i'm just saying that NTs aren't nearly that efficient.


Congratulations, you win the "dumb post of the week" award.


hooray. (insert sarcastic remark here)

06-20-2010 07:48 PM
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Ivar T
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Post: #140
RE: The cause of Asperger's : Evolution

It sounds better when there actually is a sarcastic remark.


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06-20-2010 07:58 PM
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cynara



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Post: #141
RE: The cause of Asperger's : Evolution

Ars Arcanum Wrote:

Pikajedi3 Wrote:

Ars Arcanum Wrote:
perhaps my sources were faulty. but i'm pretty sure hitler was an aspie. no NT could pull something that big off so successfully. i'm not glorifying the holocaust, i'm just saying that NTs aren't nearly that efficient.


Congratulations, you win the "dumb post of the week" award.


hooray. (insert sarcastic remark here)


Why? Couldn't you think of one yourself?




When I am an old woman, I shall wear purple with a red hat that doesn't go, and doesn't suit me.And I shall spend my pension on brandy and summer gloves and satin candles, and say we've no money for butter.I shall sit down on the pavement when I am tired and gobble up samples in shops and press alarm bells and run my stick along the public railings and make up for the sobriety of my youth.I shall go out in my slippers in the rain and pick the flowers in other people's gardens. And learn to spit...

This post was last modified: 06-20-2010 08:05 PM by cynara.

06-20-2010 08:03 PM
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raew



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Post: #142
RE: The cause of Asperger's : Evolution

adriant.esq Wrote:

raew Wrote:
...I think about a verse in the Old Testament...that says "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart." I prefer to think that this is how I was formed and that that means it simply is and that's all I need to know...


That just about sums up my attitude about why I am what I am and who I am. I was fortunate enough to study comparative philosophies and religions in my childhood and early teens, which gave me a stoic outlook. Now, 50 years on, and retired from my career, I am touching base with and updating all I read then; and am finding it fascinating.


So do I, and I appreciate what you shared. Right now I'm reading "Between Two Souls, conversation with Ryokan" which is a conversation between a modern day Roman Catholic nun and a nineteenth-century Zen monk. Ryokan was a Japanese poet and the nun began reading one of his poems every day and reflecting on them. I love the simplicity of this and two people of such different backgrounds with the same souls.




"Once you can accept the universe as matter expanding into nothing that is something, wearing stripes with plaid comes easy."
--Albert Einstein
06-20-2010 09:55 PM
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142857



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Post: #143
RE: The cause of Asperger's : Evolution

Lizmom23 Wrote:
I agree that Aspergers is evolutionarily influenced, but my reasoning is a little different.

I think that Aspergers represents the "in-between" state of NT and classic autism. Imagine, for example, that NT carry two copies of a master sensory gene (SS).��At some point, the gene aquired a mutation (M). Two copies of the mutated gene (MM) produces autism. One copy of the original gene, and one mutated one (SM) produces Aspergers. Clearly, autism is not going to increase reproduction and will not be selected for by natural selection. BUT, as it the case with a number of recessive diseases, the heterozygous condition confers an advantage, therefore the mutant gene stays around. Two copies of the sickle cell trait is lethal. But one copy reduces malarial infection. Two copies of the cystic fibrosis gene is lethal. But one copy confers resistance to tuberculosis. So two copies of the yet-to-be determined mutated sensory gene cause severe problems, but one copy results in advantages - and therefore stays in the population.��I'll go further and say that as we have moved from a society of hunter/gathers/farmers/etc to a society where security is derrived from economic success, benefits from Aspergers type is increasing, producing even more ASD in the population.


Apologies if this has been pointed out earlier. I have a slow connection ATM and I have only read a few pages.

I like the idea, and I have been thinking along similar lines.

But... in the scenario described above an autistic child would need, at least, 2 aspie parents. So that it would be possible to inherit an "M" gene from each parent. Even having one NT parent would make it impossible to be autistic... but still possible to be an aspie.

I do think that the genes for autism and aspergers are associated with very positive characterstics. I would be very interested to see any study on whether NT people with autism or aspergers in their bloodlines have a higher incidence of positive characterstics like high intelligence, a talent for business, and so on. I know that of the 4 kids in my family we have one aspie, one HFA (me) and 2 who appear to be NTs. All above the 99th percentile for IQ, not that any of us has done much with it. If the genes for autism and aspergers were not associated with positive characteristics then they would have been deselected long ago. Much the same as the examples of sickle cell anaemia and cystic fibrosis.

The incidence of sickle cell anaemia is higher in areas that are more prone to malaria. Evolution maintains a balance between the protection offered by a single recessive gene and the risk of inheriting 2 recessive genes. The genes that trigger LFA, HFA and aspergers are more complex, but perhaps something like the same process is at work.

06-21-2010 09:00 AM
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nialll



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Post: #144
RE: The cause of Asperger's : Evolution

Ars Arcanum Wrote:
perhaps my sources were faulty.


no, your sources are most definitely faulty.


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06-22-2010 04:07 PM
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nialll



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Post: #145
RE: The cause of Asperger's : Evolution

Pikajedi3 Wrote:

Ars Arcanum Wrote:
perhaps my sources were faulty. but i'm pretty sure hitler was an aspie. no NT could pull something that big off so successfully. i'm not glorifying the holocaust, i'm just saying that NTs aren't nearly that efficient.


Congratulations, you win the "dumb post of the week" award.


can we do this every week? Smile


now i've opened my eyes
i can see your light
when i open my eyes
i see i'm alive
06-22-2010 04:08 PM
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Duckfetishgirl



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Post: #146
RE: The cause of Asperger's : Evolution

Pikajedi3 Wrote:

Ars Arcanum Wrote:
perhaps my sources were faulty. but i'm pretty sure hitler was an aspie. no NT could pull something that big off so successfully. i'm not glorifying the holocaust, i'm just saying that NTs aren't nearly that efficient.


Congratulations, you win the "dumb post of the week" award.


Whaaaaaat????!!! None of my posts were winners???? **indignant**

Or am I confusing "crazy" with "stupid"?


I have a gift for enraging people, but if I ever bore you it will be with a knife.

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06-23-2010 01:33 AM
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adriant.esq



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Post: #147
RE: The cause of Asperger's : Evolution

hahahahahaha

06-25-2010 03:30 AM
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adriant.esq



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Post: #148
RE: The cause of Asperger's : Evolution

i luv this place

06-25-2010 03:31 AM
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Genesis



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Post: #149
RE: The cause of Asperger's : Evolution

Duckfetishgirl Wrote:

Pikajedi3 Wrote:

Ars Arcanum Wrote:
perhaps my sources were faulty. but i'm pretty sure hitler was an aspie. no NT could pull something that big off so successfully. i'm not glorifying the holocaust, i'm just saying that NTs aren't nearly that efficient.


Congratulations, you win the "dumb post of the week" award.


Whaaaaaat????!!! None of my posts were winners???? **indignant**

Or am I confusing "crazy" with "stupid"?


I don't even know where to begin..... I think its just Pika being Pika....


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06-25-2010 03:36 AM
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micgrace
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Post: #150
RE: The cause of Asperger's : Evolution

No Hitler was a criminal psychopath. People let him get away with things initially and WW2 was the result. There are a few of them around and more than a few companies have come to realise the psychopath who operates on their own agenda of control needs to be eliminated from their company if they wish to survive in the longer term. But often it is too late.

Hitler is definitely a good study into criminal psychopathy. He used every method legal or otherwise to achieve his agenda which quite simply was total control.

Methods for a pyschopath,
Identify those that will happily do ones bidding.
Eliminate all opposition by any means fair or foul.
Divert the attention of people to something else.
Rant and rave and mesmerise.
Always blame someone else.


Rule 1. Never, ever, give up (mind blanks excepted)
Rule 2. Refer to rule 1.
06-26-2010 12:19 AM
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