I am aspie, female and definitely not a feminist. So I do not agree with your comparison theory. However, I do agree that the NT's are labelling autistics with all the "bad labels". Mostly they are referring to what they consider negative aspects of autism and using them to point out why "lower functioning" autistics need to be "cured" or "treated". All the attritubutes of aspies that they hate -- they are ignorant about and just blame us for having "bad personalities". This is why personality testing and profiling is being done in employment and why they are insisting that autistic children be treated.
I do blame some of the problems with Nt's prejudice on feminism however. The insistence that children "fit" into daycare and schools is part of the problem. If more women felt that they could stay home and care and educate their children without feminism pressuring them into careers. (I meet more women who feel that they have to work rather than enjoy working). If you studied more about the history of feminism you might be surprised at the attitudes and values of the original feminists.
I don't think it 'goes without saying'. I think you make a very good point concerning 'the power of naming'...and your analogy is superb. Being a man myself I doubt I would have thought of such an anology.
I agree with feminist ideas and ideals...and feel that more men should.
Would someone explain "the power of naming" better. Arguing about feminism really does not have anything to do with NT's defining autistics when we should be doing that ourselves.
The pre-feminism bad-old-days are easy to forget if you weren't alive then. Those days when women couldn't get credit cards in their own name, couldn't access birth control, and weren't given advances in careers because they "would just get pregnant and leave."
No thanks!
only white women could vote in 1920.
So someone telling me that "if I believe that women should vote, then I am feminist" is "naming" me because just because I might agree with one item does not define me as something I am not. I just have "different beliefs and reasons for believing them."
A total bigot and racist might believe it is ok for someone of a different race to vote but not to hold office -- then they are still a racist.
"naming" me as a "feminist" is like telling me that I "only have Asperger's so how could I understand what suffering a person with Kanner's has." Yes, I have a different experience of autism but it is valid because it is my experience. My experience of autism is different from someone with Kanners but it is still valid.
Do you understand what I am saying?
The analogy of deaf culture to autistic culture works better than suffragette to autistic culture. It is showing more positive points about autism and the hearing impaired cultures. The suffragette to autistic culture analogy is showing the negative stereotypes of gender prejudice and prejudice against autism.
What is a useful analogy? How can such an analogy be used to help AFF's cause?
I refuse to argue about feminism. This is getting like the threads about the morality of prenatal testing for autism when all people do is argue about abortion and birth control.
Yes, M. That seems to me to be a more useful analogy than what I've seen so far (I think); deaf - autism. In that deafness is something that shows and is impossible (?) to hide. It is not something that you can leave behind when you're tired of it. And the other analogy (not really). To look at the gay pride community and their struggle for acceptance. I can see how much easier it is for persons buying into the HBTQ-labels to hide their sexuality from society and stay in the closet, while it seems close to impossible to hide your AS/HFA (well, hiding the label is quite easy; it seems). Might be because the internal wiring of homosexuality have no other consequense on the personality than the obvious, while the internal wiring of AS/HFA has so much affect on how we percieve ourselves, other people or the world that it's mind-boggling to even think about (to me it is so (well, even useless).).
We are born this way! How we are treated during our life up to the point when we break lose from parental control has everything to do with how easy life will be for us. Parents (regardless of biology) that are proud of their children and loves them for what they are and shows it to them regardless of what the world say; they do the greatest, of all, jobs! A good up-bringing makes for a life of less risk for depression etcetera.
The aspergian ideology is still in its infancy. Still in pre-school. Who's to say where we'll be when we hit two digits...
jiggeryqua, your posts are so predictable. Like so many people who are accustomed to privilege, you don't respond well when your handed-down judgments are challenged.
You start by saying "Do you attack everyone who disagrees with you?" then scream line after line of histrionic name-calling.
You cherry pick to accuse me of cherry picking.
You call names to accuse me of naming.
You call disagreement attack, then attack those who disagree.
People who oppose bigotry are bigots.
If people don't adhere to your agenda, they are "divisively politicised."
You pick a fight with your sarcastic, immature, aggressive, unpleasant and ignorant post#19 and if I respond, I am immature, aggressive, unpleasant and ignorant.
You call me a pseudo-intellectual after you say "get laid" -- a term, I take it, of authentic intellectuality and an example of what you call "intelligent debate."
You decry lumping people into "homogenous labelled groups," then rant at my "ilk."
Then after exhausting the Rush Limbaugh Glossary of Invective, you say "Get a grip."
It appears, Jiggy, that you, and your ilk, can only respond to points raised by trashing the poster.
Violence, alcohol seem a part of that subdevelopment.
Always. And I'm sure in addition to violence against women the place was a hotbed of racism, homophobia and child-abuse. Interlocking Systems of Oppression. The real social diseases.
Did you ever encounter the word "Melungeons" in WV?
Who wants to say something that could discriminate women nowadays, I'm often in fear of doing so.
Come to America, erkolos. You'll hear it plenty.
The problem with arguing about "feminism" is that it's not a single philosophy; it's an umbrella term for many different and contradictory philosophies and ideologies.
I like the classic statement by Cheris Kramerae:
"Feminism is the radical notion that women are human beings."
i'll like to make an analogy with the third reich, in which all the ''Jewish '' and ''black'' were considerated inferior just for that.
Exactly. Jewish, black, gay, certain religions. The Nazis didn't have to do much persuading to convince the people that the Others were inferior -- "it goes without saying" -- and from lesser-human to sub-human is a short jump...
When you claimed your 'victim' status, Max, did you imagine it also gave you liberty to rescind your obligation to be a decent human being?
Jiggy, go back through your far-too-many posts and see how many times you chant "I am a victim! I am a victim!" You're a victim because you're an immigrant, you're a victim because you're Aspie, you're a victim because you're male. And then those mean old "other-sexuals" came and took the word "gay" away from you. Bullies, bullies, everywhere.
Poor Jiggy hates it when people acknowledge the reality of racism and sexism because that constitutes a failure to focus on the REAL victim which is -- again and always -- poor Jiggy.
We debated sexism and racism. In what way am I "claiming victim status?" I am a white male. Like you, I benefit from racism and sexism. The difference between us is that I think those un-earned benefits are wrong and so I oppose racism and sexism.
For you, though, the privileges of your gender and race are not enough. Nothing is ever enough to compensate for the sufferings of Poor Jiggy, the universal locus of all injustice. Still you rail against all your persecutors. Poor Jiggy, victim of the world. Bitter little Jiggy. The world's only authentic victim.
Here are a couple hints for you, something you may want to trace back to your orignial "Bravo" post in this thread, but which, more importantly, might help you understand just why all these "indecent human beings" treat you like the *** you are. It may help you solve the mystery of your continual victimization.
1. When you start off with sarcasm, don't expect courtesy in response. You haven't earned it and you're not entitled.
2. When you confront a gay man, telling him "I take offense at your using the word 'gay' and I shall call you an 'other-sexual,'" you're just another homophobic internet troll -- because god knows you wouldn't have the balls to say it to my face.
People don't treat you like crap because you're male or Aspie or an immigrant, Poor Jiggy. They treat you like crap because it is an entirely appropriate response to the nasty, selfish, self-pitying bore you are: a cesspool of resentments, living in a state of perpetual offense.
Great post, Hyke
-- but what does
this mean:
I can't stand fundamentalism. Not even the atheist form of fundamentalism.