Aspies For Freedom

Although the Neanderthal theory (http://www.rdos.net/eng/asperger.htm) really isn't an environmental theory, it still explains the environmental vulnerabilities. As partly another species, autistics have a different metabolic system, which results in various vulnerabilities to environmental insults. One key is the European Hemochromatosis gene, which results in iron overload. Another key is the high meat diet of Neanderthals, which leads to different dietary adaptations that are not necesarily supplied by our modern diet and NT-adapted supplements. Vitamin A deficiency might also be quite common, and cannot be fixed by betacarotine supplements because this cannot be broken down without a specific enzyme that might be lacking in some/many autistics. There is lots of work that could be done in this area, if one just uses the correct premises.

Interesting article--and it’s given me an idea.

It seems to me that most if not all aspies have creative ability; we appear to have a far greater creative potential than is found in the general population.

In the past I’ve looked at the relationship between aspies and creativity.
I considered the possibility that the introduction of aspie traits into the human genome may have led to the birth of creativity--the origin of science, spirituality and art.

But this doesn’t make sense. Aspie creativity appears to be highly  specialised. We’re not good at all creative activities. Few aspies can dance, play sport or do drama. We tend instead to better at drawing, painting and creative writing.

If creative consciousness existed before the emergence aspie traits--and if  these traits came from the genetic influence of Neanderthals--what would their impact be on the human genome?

I suspect it would have led to a fragmentation of the creative consciousness. A heightening of certain creative skills and a lessening of others--allowing us for the first time to specialise.

The superimposing of Neanderthal traits may explain the islands of exception ability we sometimes see in aspies--while also explaining our inabilities.

Aspies should perhaps be seen as ‘creative specialists‘--focusing there creative energies on a single specialist creative subject--leading to possible mastery of that subject. While the NT’s would have a more general diffused creativity--being quite good at everything from dance to drawing--but never achieving the level of expertise of an aspie specialist.

It’s just an idea--and rather depends on whether or not ‘modern humans’ and Neanderthals actually interbred--which I believe is still a matter of conjecture.

While I hesitate to shoot anybody's ideas down in flames, I have to ask how anyone can be "partly another species".  Isn't that rather like being a "little bit pregnant"?  Surely you either are or you aren't.  

Personally I don't think AS people are related in any way to Neanderthal humans; research done on DNA stored in recovered bones is indicating strongly that Neanderthal and Modern humans were too far apart genetically to breed together successfully; apparently you wouldn't even get a sterile human from the mix, as you would get a mule with horse/donkey pairings.  And since those of us who marry NTs manage to produce children, I'd say we're not related to Neanderthals.  

However, that doesn't mean I don't think we're beginning to "split off" the main population to ultimately become a sub-grouping.  Rather like the Galapagos Island finches, adapting to their individual environments until eventually the finch populations at each end of the chain can't interbreed, although every other link in between can.   I just don't think we're there yet.  

Alison

I suppose it all rather depends on what you consider as creativity. I don’t see having social imagination as creative; nor would I see being able to fix a window is creative--practical yes--but not really requiring much originality.

Hybrids are the crosses of two species, and they are partly different from both of their ancestral species. Partly in this context means Aspies have *some* Neanderthal ancestral traits (often the traits are different in different individuals).

No, the species concept is fuzzy. It is convinient to talk about species as exact entities, but the reality is not so easy.

This is only because the wrong premises have been used in the research. Paleoanthropology and geneticists have believed in regular mixing between Hs (modern humans) and Hn (Neanderthals) in Eurasia, and such scenario is bound to be easy to detect with mitochondrial DNA. However, this is not how it was. Hn genes were introduced by introgression and not by uniform mixing. It was introgression not because it was hard (in the physical sense) to produce fertile offspring, but because of the same mechanism that still operates between NTs and Aspies. Communication, mating and social behaviors were vastly different, which meant that few individuals would find individuals in the other species interesting enough to mate with. In these discussions the stereotype that Hs males would sometimes rape Hn females is frequent, but this seems rather implausible. The Hn group structure were such that this was almost impossible. Instead it was Hn males that occasionally mated with Hs females, and this was possible because of the more open social structure of Hs. Because introgression happened into Hs it was Hn that went extinct and Hs that survived.

I haven't read this book. What does it say about the Neanderthal theory? At least the book is written after I invented the Neanderthal theory in 2001.

No, on the contrary. Evidence from raw material movements in Hs and Hn clearly suggests that Hs had larger social networks. These questions have also been in Aspie-quiz, and the preference for a large social network is an NT trait. As for tolerance, yes, in a way, Hn where more tolerant (they quite likely lacked we-them-thinking and all that follows from this). OTOH, they didn't socialize at all with strangers other than as mate exchange. So it really depends on what one wants to include into tolerance.

OK, thanks. I'll read the book just to see if she has some novel ideas.

Yeah. I don't mind other people inventing this idea as long as they haven't extensively copied my own ideas without giving credit. I'll just read it to find out if it contains novel ideas or not.

Anyone’s welcome to steel my ideas--I don’t mind--in fact I’d feel honoured if you did lol.

Your not a lemon Batman55--or any other kind of brightly coloured citrus fruit.

Although we don’t always agree--your contributions are clever and thoughtful; and often make a great deal more sense than anything I write.

You shouldn’t considered yourself an idiot--you seem a lot more intelligent than most people--with out without honours.

Opps there goes my dyslexia again...

That should have read--'with or without honours'.

You shouldn’t be so hard on yourself Batman55. You’re a clever guy who makes intelligent and insightful  comments--I for one have learnt a lot for you. Don’t worry if you post something that you later  regret--I’ve done that countless times--I’m sure many of us have. The important thing is that we contribute what we can and learn from each other. No one has all the answers, but together we can find the truth.

I think your comments concerning abstract/symbolic thinking are excellent--‘spot on' in fact. I really enjoy reading your posts; they make me see things in a whole new way--from a different angle--make me question my assertions. You have a gift for seeing things other people miss.

Because you see things differently, doesn’t mean you see them wrongly.

Guesswho, is that your picture at the bottom of your email?  

I've always thought you looked very nice: the sort of "gentle" face you rarely see on NTs, a certain childlike enthusiasm which appears to be common amongst those of us AS who haven't been too badly disillusioned by the world, or who have managed to rise above it despite everything.  

Maybe that's another thing to add to your list: we have the perseverance to survive and prosper despite being disregarded by the NTs at best or treated as something somehow sub-human at worst.

BTW, I've always thought the self-portraits by Da Vinci had the same quality.  I'm sure he was "one of us".  

Alison

Oops, I see you've got perseverance listed!  Sorry, I missed that, I'm in a hurry to start a brand-new job (I got made redundant three weeks ago, but thanks to good qualifications and being able to act "passably normie" I start a new job today.  And I'm stimming by wasting time here on the internet rather than getting all my details (bank account number, police check, superannuation details and tax file number, etc) ready!
Wish me luck!
Alison