Interesting article--and it’s given me an idea.
It seems to me that most if not all aspies have creative ability; we appear to have a far greater creative potential than is found in the general population.
In the past I’ve looked at the relationship between aspies and creativity.
I considered the possibility that the introduction of aspie traits into the human genome may have led to the birth of creativity--the origin of science, spirituality and art.
But this doesn’t make sense. Aspie creativity appears to be highly specialised. We’re not good at all creative activities. Few aspies can dance, play sport or do drama. We tend instead to better at drawing, painting and creative writing.
If creative consciousness existed before the emergence aspie traits--and if these traits came from the genetic influence of Neanderthals--what would their impact be on the human genome?
I suspect it would have led to a fragmentation of the creative consciousness. A heightening of certain creative skills and a lessening of others--allowing us for the first time to specialise.
The superimposing of Neanderthal traits may explain the islands of exception ability we sometimes see in aspies--while also explaining our inabilities.
Aspies should perhaps be seen as ‘creative specialists‘--focusing there creative energies on a single specialist creative subject--leading to possible mastery of that subject. While the NT’s would have a more general diffused creativity--being quite good at everything from dance to drawing--but never achieving the level of expertise of an aspie specialist.
It’s just an idea--and rather depends on whether or not ‘modern humans’ and Neanderthals actually interbred--which I believe is still a matter of conjecture.
You seem to skip right past the fact that there are many areas where Aspies are severely deficient in creativity; most of us seem to be very lacking in social imagination (spontaneous expression in groups, etc.), others wouldn't have the first idea how to fix a window without being shown the specific steps of how to do it (several times over.) It seems information gained from specific tasks (for some Aspies) does not always "carry over" to other, related tasks the way it does for NTs. This to me looks like a serious deficiency in creativity, as many of us can't "spontaneously" do things as we go along, intuitively.
Sorry if I'm duplicating here, but I wanted to add that I first heard about this Neanderthal theory in Jen Birch's book, Congratulations! It's Asperger Syndrome. I have not read the original link posted here, but I REALLY liked this theory as soon as I read about it in this book.
I also wanted to comment on Batman's creativity post. It has always irked me that one of the diagnostic criteria for autism includes some badly worded phrase that means we lack creativity. Every time I read such nonsense I am compelled to begin to list all of the amazing acts of creativity attributed to autistics, from art and literature all the way through to science and math. Rigid thinking and creativity are not opposites. Social conformity is the opposite of creativity, if you ask me. It just reminds me of the "hypocritical ad hominem," accusing the other person of not being able to do what you cannot do yourself, but claim you can, or accusing the other person of doing publicly the very same thing you are doing privately, and getting away with it. (Sorry no examples come to mind.)
Sorry if I'm duplicating here, but I wanted to add that I first heard about this Neanderthal theory in Jen Birch's book, Congratulations! It's Asperger Syndrome. I have not read the original link posted here, but I REALLY liked this theory as soon as I read about it in this book.
I also wanted to comment on Batman's creativity post. It has always irked me that one of the diagnostic criteria for autism includes some badly worded phrase that means we lack creativity. Every time I read such nonsense I am compelled to begin to list all of the amazing acts of creativity attributed to autistics, from art and literature all the way through to science and math. Rigid thinking and creativity are not opposites. Social conformity is the opposite of creativity, if you ask me. It just reminds me of the "hypocritical ad hominem," accusing the other person of not being able to do what you cannot do yourself, but claim you can, or accusing the other person of doing publicly the very same thing you are doing privately, and getting away with it. (Sorry no examples come to mind.)
Yes Jewelie, I was referring to a lot of those articles/statements written about AS which (personally) strike me to be somewhat true: a lack of spontaneous ability in expression of self... the articles I refer to call this "lack of social imagination." Social imagination is one "type" of imagination, and there is a bridge between imagination and creativity... to some extent.
Furthermore, I feel that a lot of Aspergians have some degree of difficulty with abstract thinking (myself included... reading between the lines in fiction/poetry is very difficult for me.) To me, this can be interpreted as either a lack of creativity (which those articles/diagnostic criteria mention), or a simple "cognitive roadblock" that NTs aren't familiar with. To me, still, this is a deficiency.
And yet... Perhaps it is the fact that we have this "abstractification difficulty," paradoxically, that makes us so creative. We live without the convenient NT filter, the "automatic template" that everyone seems to have access to... except for those with AS.
So, those with AS have to find meaning and order manually, and consider everything mindfully... every thought/item/concept in our world is considered separately, and compared to everything else. One can see how this "mindful integration" can lead to some very unique interpretations... hence, potential for great creativity.
In summary, I do agree that Aspies can have extraordinary/unusual creativity, and this is one of our greatest strengths. But at the same time, I think that problems with abstract/symbolic thinking can be considered a kind of "detractor" of creativity in some ways... and this very problem has stifled my attempts at creative expression, time and time again.
In summary, I do agree that Aspies can have extraordinary/unusual creativity, and this is one of our greatest strengths. But at the same time, I think that problems with abstract/symbolic thinking can be considered a kind of "detractor" of creativity in some ways... and this very problem has stifled my attempts at creative expression, time and time again.
I think you made a very good point there Batman55:-Aspie’s do appear to have problems with symbolic thinking--which detracts from our ability to function creatively.
Yes, and this "over-literalism" and this "abstract-thinking problem" doesn't mean we lack creativity.. it is clear that Aspies can be very creative... but it does indicate a specific problem that often affects certain kinds of creative thinking, across the board.
Especially the generalized concept of spontaneity seems to be affected by AS, but it seems we make up for this in other ways... by being mindful and looking for things that others tend to skip over, without thinking. It's been said those with AS "see things that others don't see"... I am inclined to believe it.
Social imagination is one "type" of imagination, and there is a bridge between imagination and creativity... to some extent.
We live without the convenient NT filter, the "automatic template" that everyone seems to have access to... except for those with AS.
So, those with AS have to find meaning and order manually, and consider everything mindfully... every thought/item/concept in our world is considered separately, and compared to everything else. One can see how this "mindful integration" can lead to some very unique interpretations... hence, potential for great creativity.
In summary, I do agree that Aspies can have extraordinary/unusual creativity, and this is one of our greatest strengths. But at the same time, I think that problems with abstract/symbolic thinking can be considered a kind of "detractor" of creativity in some ways... and this very problem has stifled my attempts at creative expression, time and time again.
Batman, again, fabulous thoughts. Thank you for sharing. Your ideas of "automatic template" and "mindful integration" are very powerful.
Sorry if I'm duplicating here, but I wanted to add that I first heard about this Neanderthal theory in Jen Birch's book, Congratulations! It's Asperger Syndrome. I have not read the original link posted here, but I REALLY liked this theory as soon as I read about it in this book.
I haven't read this book. What does it say about the Neanderthal theory? At least the book is written after I invented the Neanderthal theory in 2001.
There's an entire chapter at the end on the Neanderthal theory. I can't paraphrase it for you, but it could easily be browsed at your local bookstore.
You may have invented the theory in 2001, but that doesn't mean others haven't invented it as well. I thought I invented/discovered the Pareto Principle from my library work, but discovered that others had discovered the same thing long before I did. Which doesn't take away from my discovery, but does cloud the credit issue!
"Great minds think alike."
Social imagination is one "type" of imagination, and there is a bridge between imagination and creativity... to some extent.
We live without the convenient NT filter, the "automatic template" that everyone seems to have access to... except for those with AS.
So, those with AS have to find meaning and order manually, and consider everything mindfully... every thought/item/concept in our world is considered separately, and compared to everything else. One can see how this "mindful integration" can lead to some very unique interpretations... hence, potential for great creativity.
In summary, I do agree that Aspies can have extraordinary/unusual creativity, and this is one of our greatest strengths. But at the same time, I think that problems with abstract/symbolic thinking can be considered a kind of "detractor" of creativity in some ways... and this very problem has stifled my attempts at creative expression, time and time again.
Batman, again, fabulous thoughts. Thank you for sharing. Your ideas of "automatic template" and "mindful integration" are very powerful.
If I could find a way to make my thinking process useful in school or anything marketable, it would be nice. But it doesn't seem like it could possibly happen.
I still think I'm a real, bonafide lemon. Everyone always talks about getting through school faster here or with honors (AFF)--I have no such stories to report.
Sorry to complain but I don't know what my damn learning problem is. No one has ever clarified it for me. And I feel like an idiot, justifiably so. Aargh!
Sorry if I'm duplicating here, but I wanted to add that I first heard about this Neanderthal theory in Jen Birch's book, Congratulations! It's Asperger Syndrome. I have not read the original link posted here, but I REALLY liked this theory as soon as I read about it in this book.
I also wanted to comment on Batman's creativity post. It has always irked me that one of the diagnostic criteria for autism includes some badly worded phrase that means we lack creativity. Every time I read such nonsense I am compelled to begin to list all of the amazing acts of creativity attributed to autistics, from art and literature all the way through to science and math. Rigid thinking and creativity are not opposites. Social conformity is the opposite of creativity, if you ask me. It just reminds me of the "hypocritical ad hominem," accusing the other person of not being able to do what you cannot do yourself, but claim you can, or accusing the other person of doing publicly the very same thing you are doing privately, and getting away with it. (Sorry no examples come to mind.)
Yes Jewelie, I was referring to a lot of those articles/statements written about AS which (personally) strike me to be somewhat true: a lack of spontaneous ability in expression of self... the articles I refer to call this "lack of social imagination." Social imagination is one "type" of imagination, and there is a bridge between imagination and creativity... to some extent.
Furthermore, I feel that a lot of Aspergians have some degree of difficulty with abstract thinking (myself included... reading between the lines in fiction/poetry is very difficult for me.) To me, this can be interpreted as either a lack of creativity (which those articles/diagnostic criteria mention), or a simple "cognitive roadblock" that NTs aren't familiar with. To me, still, this is a deficiency.
And yet... Perhaps it is the fact that we have this "abstractification difficulty," paradoxically, that makes us so creative. We live without the convenient NT filter, the "automatic template" that everyone seems to have access to... except for those with AS.
So, those with AS have to find meaning and order manually, and consider everything mindfully... every thought/item/concept in our world is considered separately, and compared to everything else. One can see how this "mindful integration" can lead to some very unique interpretations... hence, potential for great creativity.
In summary, I do agree that Aspies can have extraordinary/unusual creativity, and this is one of our greatest strengths. But at the same time, I think that problems with abstract/symbolic thinking can be considered a kind of "detractor" of creativity in some ways... and this very problem has stifled my attempts at creative expression, time and time again.
I design logo's and you can't get any more creative, abstract and symbolic that designing a logo. 
There's quite a lot of aspie's that work in Graphic design, so I don't think that bears out the idea that aspies are lacking in any three of these area's. I love our infinity symbol.
It was kind of nice to get credit from some folks for writing that message, and kinda rotten to see someone else deflate the good feeling of having written it.
I never said all Aspies lack symbolic/abstract/creative ability... but I know that symbolic thinking is a COMMON problem on the autistic spectrum. We know that NTs are OFTEN good Symbolic thinkers, their words representative of nonverbal concepts. We know that AS are OFTEN more literal-minded than NTs.
Well perhaps I did say that "abstractification difficulty" is a fact, and that may have been a poor choice of words on my part. But then if it's not a fact, how is it so many Aspies have difficulty with fuzzy (dare we say.. abstract?) social interactions?
We know that NTs are OFTEN good Symbolic thinkers, their words representative of nonverbal concepts.
Maybe I should replace "words" in the above sentence, with body language/facial expression. Oh stuff it, I just can't get anything right.
I think I need to reiterate, find your gifts and play them up for decades.
I said decades. I am 37.
My gifts are predominantly academic, and my mother (and also father, but less so) strenuously encouraged my academic and social development through the end of college and she supported my grad school strategy too. She appropriated household money for several collections of books for children (american history, world history, creativity), other things like geographic puzzle maps of USA, first a Texas Instruments and then an IBM PCjr, and my college education, insisting that I live on campus when Dad thought it was a waste of money.
Even in the absence of both parents I buy and read books and magazines, watch digital cable (Comcast channels over 100, National Geographic Channel, Science Channel, Discovery Times Channel, Military Channel, History International, BBC America, to say nothing of Discovery Channel, Learning Channel, History Channel, Animal Planet, Discovery Health Channel, and three local PBS affiliates.)
Including kindergarten, over 20 years of classroom time, not including the self-motivated continuing education.
If I seem smart, it is not for anyone to feel bad about. God gives what He gives. And I had a mother that pushed me so hard in school I came to push myself hard too, and remain curious.
I think a better word for jealous is envious, or covetous, in that context.
What are your gifts? They could be anything.
1. Knowledge
2. Creativity
Accidental submission, sorry
1. Knowledge
any subject
2. Creativity
a. music
b. art
(1) sculpture
(2) painting
3. Character
a. perseverance
b. honesty
c. generosity
d. compassion
e. tolerance
f. gentleness
4. rare for us, but possibly athletic ability, sports ability, or the ability to exercise harder than the other folks in the gym
5. a body other adults find attractive (usually, but not always limited to, the alternate gender, never say opposite sex), look, I don't attract women by looks, today, (my BMI is still over 42, medical diagnosis of morbid obesity, BMI > 40, obesity is BMI > 30 and overweight is BMI > 25) but sometimes I interest them by having knowledge in a subject they are interested in and talk about.
6. a career and related knowledge
7. a relationship
Wikipedia.org describes falling upward as romantic attraction based on the other's superior qualities. I understand. Sociable and attractive women of any age get my attention. It is almost as if they can create the perception they want you to have of them (happy, got it all together, productive, no difficulty with dates, etc.).
Wikipedia also described nerds (allegation since retracted) last March as frequently depicted in the popular culture as lovelorn, seeking women above their "status", and also described the popular culture making sport (fun) of nerds who confidently try the same.
Most of my difficulty ended right there when I read that.
We can probably become better looking, esp. with weight loss, and painfully, we will become more sociable.
Batman, wait!
Everybody has something to offer. Discover yours and invest in it for an awfully long time.
We need a self-confidence thread, I'm serious.
I'll make one unless we have one already.
Batman, wait!
Everybody has something to offer. Discover yours and invest in it for an awfully long time.
We need a self-confidence thread, I'm serious.
I'll make one unless we have one already.
Thanks for caring, of course.
I'll check out the self-confidence thread, in a little bit.
You seem to skip right past the fact that there are many areas where Aspies are severely deficient in creativity; most of us seem to be very lacking in social imagination (spontaneous expression in groups, etc.), others wouldn't have the first idea how to fix a window without being shown the specific steps of how to do it (several times over.) It seems information gained from specific tasks (for some Aspies) does not always "carry over" to other, related tasks the way it does for NTs. This to me looks like a serious deficiency in creativity, as many of us can't "spontaneously" do things as we go along, intuitively.
I would agree,but interacting over the internet ,does wonders for one's social skills.It takes some work,and an honest effort,to apply this to real life,and it still doesn't come across "natural",but it does improve them.
Agreed. I've learned a lot of "raw information" from the Internet that I've found I can apply in real life, both in terms of learning (Wikipedia!!!) and socializing with others (AFF!!!)