I am interested to know your thoughts on this because today a woman I have know a long time said some quite nasty things to me. Our coverstation which began around work matters turned to my personal life. This is always an issue I try to avoid. She asked me if I had a girlfriend and I said no. Then she asked where I lived and with whom and I told her I lived at home with my parents she went on with the questioning and ultimately came to the conclusion that I was weird, very odd and she suggested that because of these things ( and because I wasn't gay ) that I couldn't be a real man. She also went on to suggest that I was a waste of a life and taking up space on the earth that could be better used by someone else. I would not be too concerned if this was a one-off but it isn't. Over the years many people have said similar things to me.
I have always lacked the personality traits that creates interest in relationships with other people and motivation in general. I find everyday living causes me high anxiety and stress. I am often happy just to get through a basic day of work. It means I am happy just to make simple achievements.
Am I really such a waste of time? Is she and the others correct? I don't think she is because everyone is different and I am very different compared to most. What do you think about this?
Michael, I think she's just saying those nasty things about you to make herself feel better. Perhaps she secretly feels that she's the one who's "taking up space on the earth that could be better used by someone else" ?
I think that her comments towards me and those of other people, which are always along the lines of 'you need to get a life', 'you don't live in the real world', etc. is really those people trying to offset all their insecurities about their partners and families and their life-styles onto me. They are really saying that they don't like me for not needing what they think they need. When that woman said those things to me ( as with others ) I bit my tongue so hard because to attack her back would be so easy and not in my character. I feel nothing for her except a little sadness. In my world everyday life is a struggle and I'm proud just to get through each day. I think some people are so busy chasing a dream they will never achieve so they take that frustration out on me because I don't see the value in their dream. The important thing for me is that I don't judge them negatively, they judge me negatively, so the failure is within them and not me. I think!
Yes I am more self confident than them and they know it, which is why they try to hurt me. My aim now is that should a similar situation arise again that I stop doubting myself and ask them to qualify themselves. There is a thread about the saying 'how are you?' I agree it's largely a fake question, but now I get it in first to the people who you to ask me and it's amazing how hard they find to answer it. people are always looking to me for a problem, when maybe the problem is really within themselves.
micheal1, your only problem is that you were there at a time this psycho neded to unload on somebody. If it had not been you, it would have been sombody else she attacked. It's all about her and nothing about you.
Michael,
First of all I want to thank you for writing this and say that this persons veiws dont define you at all. However, I might have something to add that would be of encouragement to you. I dont like to comment otherwise.
The way you describe yourself is similar in many ways to the way I would describe myself. It isnt often that people are overt about the ways they see me but it has happened and I have often got the impression ( weather directly or indirectly) that people saw me the way this person said they saw you. The thing is that I never really thought much about how it made me feel but it really did hurt to know that others saw me this way. I certainly never told anyone about it the way you have here. Thanks for doing that.
The thing is that 6 years ago a woman sought a relationship with me. I would have pursued her if I had any idea how. Im so glad she did. We have been married for 5 and 1/2 years. Shes great and she means the world to me. She is so different than me and our marriage seems sooooo different to everybody (and I do mean everybody).
I really didnt do much changing and I certainly can give you any neat picture of what women want or what anyone like or dislikes about me or people in general that made any difference in our case. Ive made alot of adjustments since Ive been married but not fundemental changes about who I am or what Im really like.
The thing is that my wife saw worth in me that no one had seen (or at least no one had told me they say me this way) and she has taught me to see worth in myself. Not because of my ability to change. Just because Im me.
The thing is that you have far more worth than that person who talked to you said you had and far more worth than anyone says that descibes you that way. I hope you know that.
Sorry, I spelled something wrong. I meant I certainly "can't" give you a neat picture of what people want, like, or dislike. The last time I wrote "can" when I meant "cant". The reason of course that I "cant" do this is because I dont really know. Im just relating my experience which is all I can ever really do.
Wow! What a ***!
I think the fact is that you don't know how to protect yourself and leave yourself wide open to these kinds of attacks. This is not through your own fault however as AS can steal away one's intuitions for dealing with situations like this and further more preventing them in the first place.
Here's a harsh truth: Women are not attracted to men they percieve as weak, and can be rather hurtful towards them as you have experienced here. When she was asking you if you had a girlfriend and where you lived she was REALLY asking you if you're a loser (According to her value system). You should never have answered these questions and just said , "What does it have to do with you?"
What you need is to learn how to become assertive, and what people are really getting at when they ask you these questions. I know you're not really a loser. You are just a person with AS that gives you certain difficulties. If you keep reacting in the way you do, these accusations towards you will continue.
Yes you are right. She may have had a problem that day and she is nasty and horrible. She knew I was immature where these things were concerned and it didn't take much for her to get me to tell her all these negative things about myself. Its true that I am immature where close relationships are concerned and I stick with my parents because its security and protection. I shouldn't be telling people about this because it does make me look weak and childish and a loser. It is AS that causes this it makes knowing when to tell the truth is going to be the right thing to do and once I've told truths like I have I continue being seen as weak and worthless. It is all very complicated.
Maybe I would be better off not talking about myself at all until I am confident with the person. If someone asks me if I have a girlfriend perhaps I should try saying something like 'not at the moment'. That would make me sound a little less odd. Maybe when people ask who I live with I should say 'relatives at the moment'. I think these answers are true and a bit more socially acceptable because I'm saying 'at the moment' and that removes the permenance or failure ( loser ) aspect. It may give the impression that I am interested in a relationship at some stage or living somewhere else.
Often when I speak I tend to say things that make me look stupid or weird. Saying nothing might be better for a while. I tend to think that people who have known me for a long time ask me things about myself because they are looking for a stupid reply or a self-put down not really to hear what I have to say. I ramble when I speak or talk non-stop and 'dig myself into bigger and bigger hole'. Someone said yesterday that working with me was like being in the twilight zone. Perhaps I should learn to be more assertive with work related comments but otherwise shut up.
I believe I can say this because my living circumstances are similar to Micheal’s. I too live with my parents (my mom, not my dad) I work and pay rent to my mom. I, like Micheal have a lack of ambition and motivation. I don’t drive (I walk five miles to work most days) and living life by the day often seems to be tedious, mundane, frustrating, and hopeless.
I have to disagree with what most of you have posted thus far because I don’t believe any of you are looking at the whole picture.
Before I go on I want to let you know that people consider me a loser and are vocal about it for the very same reasons that Micheal here got he ridicule he did.
People are animals, believe it or not we are animals and the law of nature (Survival of the fittest) drives our very instincts. Examples of this would be the relationship between predator and prey, and the alpha male’s privilege to spread its seed among the females in a heard or pack.
If we put aside the dogma, the man made delusions, and the rest of the distractions of human life it is quite clear that in reality (even though it seems insignificant) we by our very core are driven by the law of nature. (This is why power corrupts people, and this is why communism always turns into totalitarianism) it seems to me the law of nature is obsolete to us since we dominate over every single aspect of the living world. All other animals are defenseless against us. Within our confined shelters we can control climate and temperature. (in our bathrooms we can make it rain and our air conditioners obviously allow us to control the temperature) and instead of having to hunt our food is conveniently packaged for us.
But there is one thing that controls every human life rather you like it our not. it is called money. Rather or not you have food, shelter, water, the privilege to procreate, etc… relies completely on how much money you have. Therefore the fittest is not the one who is the most athletic (as in the animal kingdom) but instead it is the one with the most money. So therefore someone who has the means to live on their own and have excess would be consider the strong, those of us living with our mothers struggling to make ends meet would be the weak. (the being the winners and us being the losers)
As an important side note, money is acquired through means of social interaction, your worth isn’t based upon what you know but rather if you have a piece of paper from an accredited university that says you are worthy, and even that cant help you if in an interview process the employer decides your social abilities are inept.
We with AS truly have a disability. Its not a disability because we aren’t capable of what NTs are capable of. It is because we live in their world, we have to play by their rules otherwise we can’t survive in this society. As Aspies we have to adapt, not because their way is better but because its their society.
So when the **** *** (yes she was a **** ***) called you a loser it wasn’t because she was insecure (well some of it probably had to do with that) but it was her way of telling you that she was better than you, of course she didn’t have the intellectual capability to express that.
But of course she is wrong, the truth is she might be better off than you, which even that is doubtful since she works where you work, but at the same token it is obvious why the society considers us week. They run around trying to stab each other in the back, chasing glory and money because it is the only measurement of worth in our society. But guys like you and me (there are also NT people who are unmotivated and fit into Micheals and my category) don’t care about all of that, we are happy to make it by with whatever we can. There is nothing wrong with it but within our society guys like us will always be looked down upon.
We with AS truly have a disability. Its not a disability because we aren’t capable of what NTs are capable of. It is because we live in their world, we have to play by their rules otherwise we can’t survive in this society. As Aspies we have to adapt, not because their way is better but because its their society.
So when the **** *** (yes she was a **** ***) called you a loser it wasn’t because she was insecure (well some of it probably had to do with that) but it was her way of telling you that she was better than you, of course she didn’t have the intellectual capability to express that.
But of course she is wrong, the truth is she might be better off than you, which even that is doubtful since she works where you work, but at the same token it is obvious why the society considers us week. They run around trying to stab each other in the back, chasing glory and money because it is the only measurement of worth in our society. But guys like you and me (there are also NT people who are unmotivated and fit into Micheals and my category) don’t care about all of that, we are happy to make it by with whatever we can. There is nothing wrong with it but within our society guys like us will always be looked down upon.
Yes, under the current circumstances you and people with AS are disabled. Probably, I can agree to put it this way. But probably, I won't. The fact that people do not know enough about autsitic brain does not mean there is something wrong with autistic people. Human civilization exists for thousands years, and morally and spiritually hasn't progressed a lot since its very beginning. I am very much affraid I sound pathetic, but the truth is that we hasn't found the God yet and He didn't say yet that our way is the only good way. Money is not a God. We live in a money world, you are right, and few of us live with the God. I just want to say, that we live because we are to be appreciated for what we are, not because we are to be hated. We need to progress in understanding of diversity. Not only train our autistic and asperger kids to adjust to self-confident us, but to doubt ourselves and our ways of living and change them for better.
I cannot possibly imagine what it is like to live in a world, ruled by people with different type of psychics. I am an NT living in NT world. But I would like to ask you to not trust us when we are mistaken. Forgive us for not knowing. Again, I am affraid to sound pathetic, and not practical. I teach my son to speak my language and live in the real world. But one thing that I would like to make clear is that every AS man and woman are real. Michael is one of the most real persons for me, even though we never met. You were brave enough to disclose your doubt in yourself, and not every NT man can do it.
Just wanted to disagree that AS are losers, and should be ashamed about living with parents, not going out. It's OK to be different.
lets keep god and spiritual beliefs out of this.
I think what you have written is noble and idealistic but in truth, the majority of the NT population doesn't care, and why should they? it has nothing to do with their material wealth or any other aspect of their lives.
and the NTs that do care are incompedant and wish to eliminate our very thoughts. they would have us be druged up brainwashed drones rather than help us adapt. they touture us in JRC, they call us an epidimic. I saw this one add that said "having a child with autism is like someone kidnapping your childs personality and soul" (I can post a link to the add).
I am glad you arent jaded but at that same token you have to look at the situation realistically, life for a person with aspie is like playing poker with a bad hand.
I think the kind of comments this woman made and the many similar comments I recieved from other people will continue for the reasons green0horse says. I'm not into status or money ( which often really means being in debt ) or being popular. I don't show affection to others so I don't expect it back and when it happens I reject it, so its no surprise I feel distant from people. I can't change this and wouldn't want to.
In the wider world I am not living correctly or doing the right things. The polite term is different. Weird isn't so bad. Loser is what people really mean. People think this even if they are nice to me or enjoy my company. I am still defective to them. And I don't know anyone else who is my age and is like I am.
I don't play the victim, far from it, everyday is a fight and today is another day survived. In reality I have had to work quite hard today serving lots of customers and it is tiring. At the end of it I have been paid, but I've achieved nothing of value for myself. So I'm wrong to do the things that help her and those like her to aspire to her ideals of life i.e. do a *** job, for *** money, to buy more *** stuff. I would love to leave that situation, but I don't think I should be forced out of my income which I earn fairly. My income pays for the interests I enjoy.
I go to work to earn money to enjoy my life away from work not to be involved in all this interpersonal stuff, but it is unavoidable.
It helps me to so thankyou. I accidentally hit that woman over the head with a sign that fell of the desk today. It hurt her and made me smile! She says she isn't planning to bully me anymore. She is a bad germ! Turns out her husband lives away alot, I've no idea why.....!
There seem to be rather too many people like this. Always trying to maintain their social status and confidence by attempting to stigmatise and put down others. The reasons are irrelevant now though because I realise that I have been doing the same job now for 56 months and I have become bored and fed-up. I focused on her stupid remarks because I had the time to be destracted. The job makes me feel low and unhappy because there is no challenge so her comments caught me in that mood and made them sound ten times worse.
Her comments rather than hurt me have inspired me too make a change, I have been offered a new job which I have time to think about and I am applying for others. I have alot of skills and experience so I feel alot more positive now.
I am pleased the thread has helped others not feel so different either. Her negative comments have had a positive outcome for me really because it has given me confidence and motivation to move on.
I am getting too old to care about bullies and their issues.
And in answer to my own question, I am a real man and so are all the people like me and I should never has doubted that.