Aspies For Freedom

Gareth Wrote:

Bill Gates :lol:

Well, I was guessing it was by an evil, amoral, capitalist b@$tard.

So I was right then.

Gareth Wrote:

I hate bill gates as much as the next geek, but he had some points here.

Yes, if the height of one's aspiration is to be another Bill Gates Smile

As soon as I hear people talk about "real life" I reach for the custard pies... it generally means a very narrow and nasty part of existence that ignores everything good about life and the experiences of most of the rest of humanity. And generally boils down to shafting other people for cash.

Gareth Wrote:

I'd rather make money in a legitimate way (microsoft are well known for illegal business practices) not by becoming the next Bill Gates.

I'd rather help overthrow capitalism so that people could get on with being human rather than making money.

Gareth Wrote:

There are several good points about how life really is here though - real life does indeed have very few breaks and you won't be given many second chances when you screw up like you get at school. This doesn't mean there's nothing good, just that you do have to actually put up with some crap to get the good stuff.

Indeed. And telling people to shut up, take the crap and then dish it out when they get higher up the food chain is a sure way to make things continue like this.

Gareth Wrote:

And what do you propose become the new currency after you get rid of the need to make money? Or do you think that everyone regardless of how hard they work should get the same rewards?

Do we currently live in a world that rewards hard work and nothing else? Really?

Most people round where I live spend most of their life working harder and longer than most CEO's and end up where they started, in rubbish housing with not enough money to feed and clothe their kids let alone themselves.

Or what about the people in other countries who make Nike for a pennies a week for 20-hour days so that other people can get rich off the back of their work?

Gareth Wrote:

No system is perfect, but to suggest that nobody should be allowed to earn more is quite reprehensible. Under a communist-type system, everyone would be given the same even if they were incredibly lazy or worked constantly. Under capitalism, you can earn your way to higher income through hard work. All the people who are never given a chance to put in this hard work are a shame, but this does not mean that the right to trade freely should be stripped.

(Erm, I'm not (and never have been) a communist, and I'm not advocating communism.)

OK. Two things:
1) Most people cannot work their way to a higher income.
2) Higher incomes are gained by exploiting other people's hard work by paying them less than they produce and pocketing the difference.

I do love this idea that flipping burgers for a pittance so that other people can gain the extra cash is somehow morally good. It's the 21st century version of the 17th century Protestant God telling people to do as they're told and not make a fuss about it. Only now there's the added nastiness of dangling out the carrot: "if you work hard then you can get on" (with the obvious corollory that if you're poor then it's all your own fault).

Oh, and people aren't fundamentally lazy. You only need to force people to work when you're exploiting them.

http://www.snopes.com/language/document/liferule.htm

Gareth Wrote:

Who said flipping burgers has anything to do with morality?

I think someone mentioned duties to society...

Gareth Wrote:

The basic point is if you have to choose between unemployment and flipping burgers then flipping burgers is better as you actually get income from it.

Not necessarily. What if you spent the unemployment time, for example, helping to code an open source application that helped thousands of people?

Unemployed != unproductive/unhelpful to society/unwanted/subhuman.

Dustpuppy Wrote:

And generally boils down to shafting other people for cash.

It more generally boils down to earning his cash and then being extremely generous with it far more then those with sour grapes who insist its not fair.

Quote:

No system is perfect, but to suggest that nobody should be allowed to earn more is quite reprehensible. Under a communist-type system, everyone would be given the same even if they were incredibly lazy or worked constantly.

Just a slight point, I agree its a reprehensible system, but the classic capitalist outcry is here that
"Under a communist-type system, everyone would be given the same even if they were incredibly lazy or worked constantly."
which isn't exactly true. Hard workers get the same pay, 'lazy' workers get the same pay plus a bullet in the neck.

Gareth Wrote:

If you couldn't afford a computer and were unemployed you wouldn't be capable of doing that. Refusing a burger-flipping job and choosing total poverty instead is foolish.

Why?

i'd just put money into my business if i had one at the time, or use it to invest in my ideas, maybe a bit to charity.

how can the world give you something if you don't give something back? with the services and products the business makes, the jobs the business creates and of course the charity donations.

Ian

true freedom in my opinion is just that, if you want to work, work if you don't, don't

but remember, working will always have more benefits Wink

(pun not intended)

Ian

DW_a_mom Wrote:

Ian Wrote:

true freedom in my opinion is just that, if you want to work, work if you don't, don't

but remember, working will always have more benefits Wink

(pun not intended)

Ian

Agreed. As long as you don't expect taxpayers to fund your life, and don't whine about what your neighbors have that you don't. As long as people realize they are, in fact, making choices, and are content with them, for the most part, I can respect it.

well ya see i want a business when i'm older, hell i'm 18 now and i'm trying to get a small one started..don't worry about me living on taxpayers money, i'll pay my own way

Ian

ever hear of the princes trust? they help out businesses in england with financial and start up matters.

methinks you've got something wrong, as usual, i'll merely pay my own way once the business is up and running.

try research next time Wink

Ian

some businesses need taxpayers money...well if you count the british royal family as a business

:wink:

DW_a_mom Wrote:

Ian Wrote:

DW_a_mom Wrote:

Ian Wrote:

true freedom in my opinion is just that, if you want to work, work if you don't, don't

but remember, working will always have more benefits Wink

(pun not intended)

Ian

Agreed. As long as you don't expect taxpayers to fund your life, and don't whine about what your neighbors have that you don't. As long as people realize they are, in fact, making choices, and are content with them, for the most part, I can respect it.

well ya see i want a business when i'm older, hell i'm 18 now and i'm trying to get a small one started..don't worry about me living on taxpayers money, i'll pay my own way

Ian

Good luck with your business! It's a fantastic learning experience, whether or not the business becomes a success.

Just FYI, btw, I meant to use the generic "you," not to actually mean you as an individual. In the quoted post.

Aww thanks Big Grin

Yeah it will be a learning experience, i'm doing a business course at college in september so that should give me more knowledge than i already have (you know us aspies, squirreling away with our books and websites Tongue lol). I will try to acheive my goal of getting a sucessful business, as my motto goes "all i can do is try" and thats all i'm gonna do, try and win! lol

Ian

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