07-19-2006, 09:01 PM
07-19-2006, 09:18 PM
Do you mean they want to move him into mainstream?
07-20-2006, 06:22 AM
It has been mentioned, yes.
07-20-2006, 09:16 AM
I think you should look at it with celebration - unless he has been totally indoctrinated with Unit-like behaviours, in which case he's not going to cope. I only cope with School because I've been primarily mainstream all of my life. Units/Special Schools/whatever were a bad idea; they encourage the development of anti-social behaviour; they also tend to give the person a poorer oppurtunity of education as there it is assumed that the children have poorer intelligence. Just my take on things.
Trust me, it'll be fine if he goes into the 'M' word. :grin:
Trust me, it'll be fine if he goes into the 'M' word. :grin:
07-20-2006, 10:22 AM
Look at it with celebration? Yeah, great he'll be placed in a class of NTs with an entitlement complex. He'll be made fun of, and the teachers will ignore his victimization at the hands of other students. The teachers will tell Alex, he can't get any extra time or help. Even if he is SPED, all that means to a mainstreamed teacher that they have to "tard-sit".
Mainstreaming is, and always has been, a stupid stupid idea. Talk about sending someone into the lion's cage. I don't see it as something to celebrate, it's a sign of the Special Education system in that school misfunctioning. "Oh well they get good grades, I guess we can just send them to mainstreaming so we don't have to deal with them." It's just the Special Ed people pawning a student off, because if they make decent grades, oh they just can't have problems. Yeah, right.
Also, about anti-social behaviour. I have never seen such anti-social behaviour, as I have seen in mainstream classes. Do you really think that bullying other children to raise one's self up is pro-social?
Mainstreaming is, and always has been, a stupid stupid idea. Talk about sending someone into the lion's cage. I don't see it as something to celebrate, it's a sign of the Special Education system in that school misfunctioning. "Oh well they get good grades, I guess we can just send them to mainstreaming so we don't have to deal with them." It's just the Special Ed people pawning a student off, because if they make decent grades, oh they just can't have problems. Yeah, right.
Also, about anti-social behaviour. I have never seen such anti-social behaviour, as I have seen in mainstream classes. Do you really think that bullying other children to raise one's self up is pro-social?
07-20-2006, 12:06 PM
violet_yoshi Wrote:
Look at it with celebration? Yeah, great he'll be placed in a class of NTs with an entitlement complex. He'll be made fun of, and the teachers will ignore his victimization at the hands of other students. The teachers will tell Alex, he can't get any extra time or help. Even if he is SPED, all that means to a mainstreamed teacher that they have to "tard-sit".
Mainstreaming is, and always has been, a stupid stupid idea. Talk about sending someone into the lion's cage. I don't see it as something to celebrate, it's a sign of the Special Education system in that school misfunctioning. "Oh well they get good grades, I guess we can just send them to mainstreaming so we don't have to deal with them." It's just the Special Ed people pawning a student off, because if they make decent grades, oh they just can't have problems. Yeah, right.
Also, about anti-social behaviour. I have never seen such anti-social behaviour, as I have seen in mainstream classes. Do you really think that bullying other children to raise one's self up is pro-social?
Mainstreaming is, and always has been, a stupid stupid idea. Talk about sending someone into the lion's cage. I don't see it as something to celebrate, it's a sign of the Special Education system in that school misfunctioning. "Oh well they get good grades, I guess we can just send them to mainstreaming so we don't have to deal with them." It's just the Special Ed people pawning a student off, because if they make decent grades, oh they just can't have problems. Yeah, right.
Also, about anti-social behaviour. I have never seen such anti-social behaviour, as I have seen in mainstream classes. Do you really think that bullying other children to raise one's self up is pro-social?
If the class you're in is filled with dimwits, then yes, there is the concern of bullying and discrimination of the SPED persons. However, I didn't look at it from that perspective; in part because my school's frequency of lesser-behaved Neurotypicals isn't so high. Don't attack me for my point of view. The people in my school just happen to be more open-minded about the whole 'me-being-different' thing and it's hardly noticable most of the time. Also, my present school doesn't have a Special educational department; neither did a few other schools I went to. My parents just wanted to get me into the Mainstream as soon as possible, so I don't suffer from such bullying problems later on and develop a reasonable social life - while maintaining my intelligence and education (I'm in top classes for most of my subjects - probably why the people aren't immature dimwits as is evident to what you're refering to). Look, why do people have an obbsession of attacking ANY view that I come out with? "Communism is bad - A mainstream educational environment is traumatising" - it's called life. I have had to deal with it daily up until the summer holidays. Sure, there are the few Non Educated Delinquints (NED's, a Scottish localism for the English equivelent Chav's, who are retarded idiots in burberry hats and sports clothing and do nothing all day but get drunk and be anti-social) who have tried to ruin me, I ignored those, they eventually got expelled. Maybe the Schooling system where you come from is worser, I've no idea, do I? Perhaps if your government wasn't ran by an ape with an IQ <80, maybe that would stop happening, no?
Anyway, I'll revise my advice seeing as it has raised this evil skepticalism (I don't take critisism so well when It's written like that, somehow he can show respect to the AFF elite, but once an outside come in it's "blam, let's kill the intruder"):
If his schooling history is much like mine, go for it. If it's not so good, keep him there, but not for too long; Does he have an adequete education? Has he beyond basic literacy skills? Does he have more than '1 close buddy friend' which is a ploy set up by the SPED department in the first place? If the answer is no to all of those, you may as well put him in mainstream. However, if the school has a bad bullying history or whatever like the person I'm quoting (look, can I even be bothered to look what his username is now that he's treated me like utter crap?), go to another School immediately.
For the record, yes I have Aspergers. I just don't see so much of the fuss - and it's more the School's fault in controlling the NT b******s than the NT's themselves. Some NT's are quite nice.
07-21-2006, 01:25 AM
My son is mainstreamed and it works for him. Our school advocates acceptance accross the board, so teasing isn't what it might be in another locations. Plus, *mischevious snicker*, my son has a manipulative mommy who knows how to play certain cards with certain kids when need be.
I have to say this is really an individual by individual issue. Case by case, child by child. I expect that mommy knows best, but I also know that my son's teachers have pushed me a few times beyond my comfort zones for my son and they have actually been right . Ask a lot of questions as to why the school thinks this is the right move, and how they plan to address your concerns. If you don't get the answers you need, don't follow the plan. It's our job to be overly protective of our children; it is their job to push our children. Neither side is right all the time. Take the time to explore it.
I have to say this is really an individual by individual issue. Case by case, child by child. I expect that mommy knows best, but I also know that my son's teachers have pushed me a few times beyond my comfort zones for my son and they have actually been right . Ask a lot of questions as to why the school thinks this is the right move, and how they plan to address your concerns. If you don't get the answers you need, don't follow the plan. It's our job to be overly protective of our children; it is their job to push our children. Neither side is right all the time. Take the time to explore it.
07-21-2006, 11:00 AM
A few things to clear:
Most of the 'he's' were refering to the kid whose school is mentioning teh 'M' word, not you.
I'm looking it from a different perspective, what I've experienced myself at School. Parent's don't always know what's best unless the child is fully incommunicable - in which there's no choice. Also, we don't get help for slitting our wrists or anything; school is still yet to care about flipping emo's (which I personally think are moronic and stupid, the emo's that is).
I've considered slitting my wrist more than once - then I realised that superiority as an Aspie was enough of a reason not to get a byproduct of Neurotypical culture become part of me.
I'm only 15, I shouldn't actually be here; but I'm a little bit like a 'hop along', I intefere in quite a bit - it's too much that parent's assume without knowing some amount of what they're talking about (but as far as this forum goes, the parents here are more valid than my own could ever be). I'd be the kind of kid that snoops on teachers paperwork - to see what's really going on behind the fascade of everything around the school. And yes, I do try to look for my grades in advance on tests. Normally, the teacher takes days to mark them.
A bit off topic, so I'll get back on track: I think the advantages of Mainstream; the prospect of somewhat better education, will outweigh the socio-discriminative disadvantages of bullying and the like once the evil imbiciles (Neurotypical Chavs/NED's) are tolerated - it's only then that good potential can be achieved in such an environment. I've had to tolerate it alot of times, trust me. But then, the best insults they can think of is actually listing the stereotypes of my condition - it gets old thankfully.
Some funny ones from people in my school:
"You can't communicate."
Hello, what the f*** am I doing now?
"You have trouble writing."
I think that's called Dyslexia, idiot... and I think I'm a damn sight more literate than you.
"Mongol, mongol, mongol"
Downs reference...
These people probably grow up to become members of CAN, I wouldn't be suprised. I hope they die in a capitalist, Neurotypical, and agonising death. One that would be really horrible. Okay, so I'm not entirely neurodivergent - but at least I'm on the side of Aspies, there's too far and few between of these people (that is, those on the side of Aspies), don't you agree?
Most of the 'he's' were refering to the kid whose school is mentioning teh 'M' word, not you.
I'm looking it from a different perspective, what I've experienced myself at School. Parent's don't always know what's best unless the child is fully incommunicable - in which there's no choice. Also, we don't get help for slitting our wrists or anything; school is still yet to care about flipping emo's (which I personally think are moronic and stupid, the emo's that is).
I've considered slitting my wrist more than once - then I realised that superiority as an Aspie was enough of a reason not to get a byproduct of Neurotypical culture become part of me.
I'm only 15, I shouldn't actually be here; but I'm a little bit like a 'hop along', I intefere in quite a bit - it's too much that parent's assume without knowing some amount of what they're talking about (but as far as this forum goes, the parents here are more valid than my own could ever be). I'd be the kind of kid that snoops on teachers paperwork - to see what's really going on behind the fascade of everything around the school. And yes, I do try to look for my grades in advance on tests. Normally, the teacher takes days to mark them.
A bit off topic, so I'll get back on track: I think the advantages of Mainstream; the prospect of somewhat better education, will outweigh the socio-discriminative disadvantages of bullying and the like once the evil imbiciles (Neurotypical Chavs/NED's) are tolerated - it's only then that good potential can be achieved in such an environment. I've had to tolerate it alot of times, trust me. But then, the best insults they can think of is actually listing the stereotypes of my condition - it gets old thankfully.
Some funny ones from people in my school:
"You can't communicate."
Hello, what the f*** am I doing now?
"You have trouble writing."
I think that's called Dyslexia, idiot... and I think I'm a damn sight more literate than you.
"Mongol, mongol, mongol"
Downs reference...
These people probably grow up to become members of CAN, I wouldn't be suprised. I hope they die in a capitalist, Neurotypical, and agonising death. One that would be really horrible. Okay, so I'm not entirely neurodivergent - but at least I'm on the side of Aspies, there's too far and few between of these people (that is, those on the side of Aspies), don't you agree?
07-21-2006, 03:54 PM
I see what you are saying AK...
\The fact that Al wouldnt be able to tell anyone if there was a problem is the most worrying thing.... because problems are inevitable.
He certainly wouldnt be capable of witty ripostes if he was insulted, like you report AK he'd just internalise them, and as he doesnt have a well defined concept that sometimes people are mean, he'd accept what they said as fact.
\The fact that Al wouldnt be able to tell anyone if there was a problem is the most worrying thing.... because problems are inevitable.
He certainly wouldnt be capable of witty ripostes if he was insulted, like you report AK he'd just internalise them, and as he doesnt have a well defined concept that sometimes people are mean, he'd accept what they said as fact.
07-21-2006, 09:13 PM
AspergiaKidd, ok sorry for the misunderstanding. I see you actually do know what I'm talking about. I think what happened in my school that is different than your school, was the amount of collective group-think in the matter.
You had a few bullies put you down, not to minimize it, but I had entire classrooms allowed to humilate me along with the permission of the teacher. I don't know really what the reason for that was at all, it was extremely counterproductive. Maybe to increase socialization by forcing me either to be an outcast, or gain an eating disorder and low self-esteem, and become one of them.
I also think that there may have been a level of sexism in my school. Where I wasn't acting like a "girl" I was standing up for myself, rather than being shy, giggly, and mindless. Where when I did something wrong, I was told to act like the other students. AKA, act more "ladylike", where they told me once when I complained about a male student simply that "boys would be boys" to which I said, "and girls will be girls".
So perhaps that was another level of adversity that I had to deal with, that maybe you didn't have to. It's like the movie New Best Friend, where the girls are much more abusive emotionally than physically. Perhaps if you rented it, you might gain more understanding of school bullying from a female angle.
You had a few bullies put you down, not to minimize it, but I had entire classrooms allowed to humilate me along with the permission of the teacher. I don't know really what the reason for that was at all, it was extremely counterproductive. Maybe to increase socialization by forcing me either to be an outcast, or gain an eating disorder and low self-esteem, and become one of them.
I also think that there may have been a level of sexism in my school. Where I wasn't acting like a "girl" I was standing up for myself, rather than being shy, giggly, and mindless. Where when I did something wrong, I was told to act like the other students. AKA, act more "ladylike", where they told me once when I complained about a male student simply that "boys would be boys" to which I said, "and girls will be girls".
So perhaps that was another level of adversity that I had to deal with, that maybe you didn't have to. It's like the movie New Best Friend, where the girls are much more abusive emotionally than physically. Perhaps if you rented it, you might gain more understanding of school bullying from a female angle.