I hated it when the girl said she wished she had a sister who did not have autism. I would punish a child for saying that.
I was very puzzled by the mother saying "people just can not understand why an 8 yr old girl is crying in the park because she does not want to go in the swing". Why would someone force a child to go on a swing or play when they do not want to?
first of all, the girl problay dosen't know any better, she was probaly told by her mom that autistics are bad all the time, and nothing good ever comes out of them. i think a better wish is for a mother that isn't an autiephobe.
and i used to cry and stuff until i was like 10-12. but its no reason to start saying that it makes life a nightmare. it's just one of those days. she thinks that all children have to be the same.
It hurts terribly when the high hopes that one had for a child are replaced with the grim realization that to get to the same place will require a mountain of effort. That's NOT "bigotry" or "ignorance" - it's an expression of a completely understandable pain at experiencing cruelly dashed expectations.
i know, but many people translate harder into worse, and then say that autistics are inferior becuase of that theory. but i know what you're talking about...but this is where it starts.
One thing this film tries to do is break through that, to convey the reality that autism in a family extracts an ENORMOUS cost on everyone else in it.
problem is that the movie is implying that autism turns everyone's lives into a living nightmare and that everyone hates caring for autistics, and many familes of autistic children do not feel that way about their lives.
it proceves the most negative familes about autistics and try to say it's the norm, and that is wrong. not all parents want to kill their kids, which they say is the norm for parents of autistic kids.
...no one had spoken out with the slightest hint of sympathy, even in passing, for what parents of autistic children go through. No one, from what was written, was moved in the slightest by their heartfelt and real emotion.
I can sympathise with the situation they're in and the fact they're feeling desperate, but I think you'll understand that to expect Autistics to apologise to those mothers for being born Autistic is a bit strange :roll: - Also, Autistics do seem to feel love and emotions differently to non autistics (They do have them, make no mistake), a lot of these mothers seem to want some kind of "love" from their kids, which I (And seemingly many other autistics) have little comprehension of, but neither can we understand why NT's get so worked up about the lack of it, being quite happy without it themselves.
It's almost impossible for them to display what is basiclly an alien concept, and the mothers getting bewildered by that helps nobody.
I think you'll find though the reason most of the AS here are more bothered with their own situation than that of the parents is that right now we have multinational corperations eeeking to "cure" autism via Eugenics - in much the same way Hitler tried "cure" the world of Jews, and needless to say going to the aforementioned Jews and asking them to apologise to the Germans for being a Jew would not likely prompt a sympathetic response.
Ah, thats makes sense. It's the reaffirmation thing, even though it should be blatently obvious, they think that if their child isn't telling them every 5 minutes "I love you mommy" that they have something seriously wrong in their lives and they don't love them.
I love my mum, but I don't think I've once ever said "I love you mommy" - but, asking her the same thing, she never had the expectation either :p - Maybe it's too many Hollywood movies leads parents to expect their new kids to be pink ribbons, waffles for breakfast and lots of telling each other "I love you" :lol:
The purpose of the video was specific and narrowly tailored: to emphasize the costs and burdens of autism and to drum up support for a cure.
Unfortunately the audience is not so specific and narrowly tailored. Anyone who goes on that site could see that video. It's not that this video is singualarly bad. It's just that it portrays Autistics in the same light that always show to the public; tragedy, disaster and sorrow. How people are viewing Autism nowadays is more like the first few seconds of that video, as howling screaming monster children. How do you a new parent who just found out that their little girl or their little boy has autism going to react to that? Or feel?
You say that the the parents are not always like this. then why isn't it in the video? Well, like you said it is is to drum up support(or rather money). That is where the real message of this video is clear. It is "if you don't help us find a cure this could be your next child". A scare tactic. that is what it is. Don't you see how wrong that is? A "charitable" organization that get support by trying to scare people (I should say organizations, Autism Speaks isn't it only ones playing this card).
But back to your original topic, do I have sympathy for the parents of autisitics.
I have great respect and admoration of most parents who have autistic kids. But for parents who talk like this, no I don't have sympathy. They want sympathy. But symapthy is exactly what the don't need. What they get too much of. These parents have known that their children where autistic for years now. and their still in mourning. That is understandable if they just found out about it. but after 5-6 or more years later. No there is something not right about that. Sooner or later they going to have let go of these feelings and accept the burden that life has placed upon them.
But these parents don't. They just keep on swimming in there pools of self-pity. And the more they focus on them the difficulties they deal with, the worse these difficulties will become in their minds. This could carry on until murderer and sucide may seem like an acceptible. Others go cure crazy. They end up trying every therapy and treatment from chelation to ABA in the hope that it will "cure" them. They end up shelling out so much money that it puts there faimily in finacial problems. And it extolls a burden on the autistic child. We know that autistics are sensitive to changes. It is tramatic for an autistic to be taken out of her/his safe place(home) and taken to stange places where strangers say and do strange uncomfortable and even painful things.
this is not heathly, not for parents or the children.
This is the problem with the cure movement. It focuses people on the false hope that there child will become normal. The hope that that their burdens will be saved by a medical Deus Ex Machina. The hard cold fact is Autism cannot be cured. you said it youself autism is a disorder not a desease. And you can't cure disorders. There are more obtainible goals to be had. You can aim to aim to help you autistic child have as happy and as fullfilling life as possible. In truth isn't that all any of us (aspie/autie/nt) can hope for?
I strongly dislike bright lights and loudness, sometimes react much more violently than the norm to being startled, am a "nerd" with an affinity for trivia, am (perhaps contradictorily) both easily distracted by multiple voices and able to achieve an intense focus that requires strong stimuli to pull me out of, sometimes prefer the logic of computers to people, value solitude, and as a child was teased and bullied unmercifully for my social awkwardness and intelligence.
You know, to me, at least, that makes me think that you are autistic. . . You seem to think that a cure is a good idea. Tell me, do you think the same way, knowing that you would be "cured" of being who you are?
If we marry as soon as possible and concieve immediately, our first child would be born when she is 35, the "magic age" at which risk factors for conditions such as autism begin to rise dramatically. She is also overweight, another substantial risk factor.
Neither of those are risk factors; you see, autism is caused by genetics. Neither age nor weight are likely to change the genetic makeup of any offspring. If you don't believe me, just go back to high school biology, and review meiosis.
If indeed there is more autism, a likely culprit is women having babies later than ever – something long associated with numerous birth defects. Another is the obesity epidemic. About 20 published studies have found that children from overweight moms, much less those who are outright obese, have higher rates of many types of birth defects. To point this out, of course, is to beg for a horsewhipping from feminists, fat activists, and trial lawyers.
Correlation does not equal causation. Who knows? Maybe women that carry the genes for autism are more likely to give birth at a later age? Maybe carrying the genes for genetic disorders also increases the chance of obesity? Maybe it's all just chance? Nothing is proved by merely stating a correlation.
I haven't read through all this thread, but as a parent interacting with other parents knowing how different the world sees autism and aspergers today than it did just 10 years ago, I think the world needs to wait before it reaches ANY conclusions on what it means to be autistic or on the austic spectrum. We are only JUST beginning to understand what the world is like for people with autism, and how to make our world and their world live together. The kinds of things that were done just 10 years ago were often destructive and counterproductive for raising austic spectrum children. The biggest change? Todays young autistic children are often highly affectionate. What I see in my son is a unique combination of extra sensitivity, extra emotion, and an ability to turn it off when the world gets too daunting. But he isn't turning it off because the world he is living in isn't threatening him, and is instead trying to adjust to HIM when it is necessary. I see so many gifts in him, and so many gifts in the children I know who are far more severly affected. Our elementary school last year gave a classroom to the country program for highly austic children (my son is light Aspergers so he is not in it; he is mainstreamed). It has been one of the best experiences for the children in our school, and the children in the class have thrived as well. There is no teasing, no staring ... just children wanting to get to know children.
So what was true raising an autistic child ten years ago, five years ago, may not be true of raising an autistic child five years from now. The more we understand, the easier it gets. A world of burden was lifted off of my shoulders once someone offered an explanation that helped me understand him. No more battles. No more frustration. I know what to do, and he knows what to do, to get over the rough spots. His friends are learning how to handle the rough spots, too. What a great world to live in - when an 8 year old patiently lets his friend flip out.
I still have so much to learn. We all do. Coming here helps a lot. Thanks for that. But to potential parents freaked out about what the future may hold, I can only suggest you let it go. You can't control or predict the future. And I wouldn't want to even if I could.
SOJAW, I wish I could say it was true everywhere, that kids were accepting of children who are different. I don't know that to be true. I DO know it to be true in OUR school, but we also extra blessed in so many ways. One of the teachers from the autistic special class told me they were "tolerated" at the school that hosted them in previous years, but at our school they have been welcomed and have felt wanted. Our school only will have space to continue hosting them for another year (it's all about enrollment patterns, all out of our control) and we will all be very sad to see them go. I think it has been excellent for all the children to have this opportunity to cross the barriers.
So, there are many, many kids growing up with a better understanding. If someone is in a place where there is teasing and intolerance, I would find another place. Better places are out there.
a lot of people out there are 1) confused as to the difference between therapy and cure, and often think the two are the same thing. Improving communication and self help skills does not equal cure. I definitely think self help skills and all that need to be developed, but this eliminates or lessens problems caused bu autism, not autism itself. 2) autism to them= extreme case scenario, total non communication, absence of self help skills etc.
Greenlion i really think you need to re define the two, only then will you be able to understand where the autistic rights movement is coming from. i hope.
For example stimming is a way to help ease anxiety, not a problem in itself. it's just.... an eccentricity at most why should this in itself need to be cured?
Thanks Crys, I just wanted to bring out that people who don't really know the entire picture, probaly shouldn't post their assumptions about others.
Which is certainly a good point.
Something must be wrong when the child hates going to see the therapist.
You mean like when the speech therapist gives a child a assignment, and expects them to do perfect on it when they know it's too difficult for the child at a certian stage. Or when they don't do it perfectly, the child gets berated at or talked down to like they're a grand idiot. Or how about when a therapist says they will reward a child for their work, and when that child doesn't complete the work because it's too advanced for them..they're not rewarded, and then brought to tears by being yelled at and told to call their parents, to tell them what a bad child they are. All because they are being pushed against their limitations.
Yeah it's because something is wrong with that child. Those were all my experiences with a speech therapist. The problem wasn't me, it was the therapist who did not have patience with me. Don't blame the victim, blame the adult who should know better.
You may have missread the quote. I think the person meant that something must be wrong in the match between therapist and child, not that something must be wrong with the child.
Any therapy is highly dependent upon a proper match of personalitites. You can have a therapist that is adored by one patient, and hated by another, simply because of personality differences. Therapists are human, and any individual has to find the one that works for them. No one gets along with or can be effective with everyone. If the relationship isn't working, as evidenced by a child who is unhappy going, then it must be changed. Period. Blame doesn't need to come into the equation.
I think that I am still trying to understand where most of you think the boundary is between acceptable therapy and an unwanted cure. Here's a hypothetical example to show you what I mean.
I think you said it yourself when you said "unwanted." That makes a huge difference. Also, your examples don't show anything in regards to curing. Your examples show acceptable therapy. Luai_lashire replied wonderfully to this.
I don't think it's that simple. How many children are there (NT or autistic) that actually WANT to go to school?
I know the point you are making, and I agree. I also know I'm only one person, but I am going to answer this rhetorical question literally.
I loved school. I didn't understand why other kids didn't. All they wanted to do was play all day. You can't get through life like that. Also, I got bored with games, but if I played after "working", it was fun, because it was a change. There were many times I didn't want to go to school, but for different reasons: some 'bad' teachers (or ones that didn't know I was autistic/didn't know how to teach autistic kids), and bullying.
I agree. Parenting is not about having the perfect family, but to allow your child a good childhood - which provides for many opportunities said child can have in the future when he or she is ready to make her own decisions, or in other words, to become an independant human being without the burden of an unhappy childhood.
To say that this isn't easy is an understatement, but nobody said parenting was easy. And yes, sometimes a parent might feel powerless regarding his/her interaction with his/her kid, but is that a reason to give up? Of course not, except for a few extreme cases (there will always be exceptions), hard work and expanding your knowledge will always make you find a way.
Yes, knowledge is a key word here. Knowledge on asd's: accepting their existence and learning what they are. But that begins with accepting (neuro)diversity as a whole, rather seeing the threat first in things unknown to you. Cause, hey, it may lead you to seeing things in another perspective and on top of that save you from doing harmful deeds to anyone or anything that actually weren't necessary.
An eradication of a (mostly) unknown phenomenon should only be used as a last resort, if you're sure it's ONLY a threat to you and/or can not be of good use to you or society as a whole. That is at least my opinion, because there are so many things that we as human beings don't know about; where would we be now if destroyed just anything that we can't figure out what they are?
And, though my opinion as an aspie may be coloured, look at it rationally. Are our personalities of bad value or of no value at all and thus disposable? I can only hope that most people have knowledge on this to know that autism (which is a part of our personality) doesn't devalue us as individuals in the greater society.
Moreover, if one does see it as a burden for their children, ask yourself this.
Would it guarantee for a good childhood if your kid did not have autism?
Is it right to mold your child in your preferred image (maybe even against their own will), instead of trying to steer him in the way to a good, 'productive' (to be become independent) youth? So, do you think that you have the right to decide what's good for a child if you don't know enough about the cause?
And if you do know about the cause but still see asd's as negative, can you honestly say that your kid's apparent impaired behaviour with (in your opinion) no good prospects, has absolutely nothing to do with your way of dealing with it (treatments of whichever pro's included?)?
And, although we are all individuals, wouldn't you want to learn from all the people with as, pdd-nos or whatever, who did manage to go through life without many obstacles?
But I digress.
To all the curebies, please read what we have said here, why we don't support people being cured of autism. We've (well at least most of us) been trying to learn to deal with NT's for virtually all our lives...........if we can do it, so can you.
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