Aspies For Freedom

DogBrain Wrote:

Simen Wrote:

Why don't you start by quoting the accusation. I haven't accused anyone of anything in this thread...

"you flame them and label them intolerant and immoral"

Did you do it on purpose, or you really can't see the full context?

That is not a rhetorical question. I'd really like to know.

Tigger_the_Left_Wing Wrote:

Literally speaking, "homophobia" means fear of the same!

Ha! Certainly not an aspie trait. Smile

Quote:

Homophobia is, however, more accurate than you might think. Studies show that men who have marked hatred of gays are also much more arroused by male-and-male erotic images than straight men who are not homophobic.

So the queer that they fear is the queer within.

Really? So the ones who have a problem with it are the ones who have a "problem" with it. That's interesting.

EvilZakkie Wrote:

earthmonkey Wrote:

Actually, a word that's pretty common (at least nowadays) around gay advocacy groups and academic discussions is almost exactly that - except it's "heterosexist", which I think was using the "hetero" because it's describing the implication that heterosexuality is superior. I also don't generally like the word homophobia, except in certain cases, and mainly when I use it is by convention rather than as the optimal word I'd choose.

But yeah, I like heterosexism better, as it also encompasses those who don't really fear gay people (while I'm sure in convoluted discussions about fear, anger, power structures etc the word fear could be rightly applied, for simplicity's sake I usually don't think of it as a fear unless it's obvious in the individual).

I remember a while back I had a complete mind blank trying to remember the word "homophobic", so I made up the word "homosexism" on the spot. There were a lot of confused people afterwards... *grins*

The closest I can think of to an accurate workable term would be "sexual preferism", though even that's a bit clumsy. Generally, I just use whatever the going terminology is, so I'd be happy using either homophobia or heterosexism.

I prefer Gay Bashing Nutjob!

NotYourAverageJoe Wrote:

I prefer Gay Bashing Nutjob!

I thought my replacement name for "homophobe" was funny, then a very polite PMer pointed out that "nutjob" is a derogatory mental health reference. Didn't even occur to me. Sorry. Geez how many times have I said sorry this week? I gotta stop letting this forum wind me up. Deep breath.

Tigger_the_Wing Wrote:

As for homosexuality; it is still possible to find schools of psychology that claim sex differences in mathematical ability! Psychology is hardly a good example of a science, -ology ending or no! It is as subjective as religion.

My opinion is somewhat similar to yours about the -logy suffixes (from the greek Logos that means ''discourse on'', but has came with time to be subject to empirical proving methods (I would be open to other proving methods though, if deemed valid). Psychology is not subject to any of this ''validity'' necessity, and that is wrong (in my opinion - ouff!! Almost goofed again).

In the Québec province, in Canada (I am from there so still following the news), psychologists are fighting for the authority to diagnose autism. Although it would indeed put some HR horsepower to the diagnosis process, I'm a bit worried........

Zakkie/CBC - seriously, when are you going to ban this jerk? It smells bad in here.

I can't believe this has been allowed to go on this long. First we had explanations of how it would be better if homosexuals were permitted to exist in society so long as they understood themselves to have a lower status in class structure, then the admonitions against race-mixing, and now we're actually allowing dissertations on "blacks are good runners" and "Jews are the best salesman". Oh, don't forget that black people are stupid! Disgusting. And in the meantime, I have to put up with some smarmy racist lecturing me on my intolerance because I won't recognise his right to his "controversial opinions". Illusion, please spare me your anarchy and Conservative Revolution.

And don't give me any more crap about people being more comfortable with people like themselves, either. I grew up in a poor neighborhood where I was one of the few whites. A couple years ago I moved to a largely white [although still kinda poor] county and, frankly, it's a little odd for me. I'm used to being around lots of African-American, Latino and Asian folks, and being around all these whites is taking time to adjust to.

Bottom line mate, there's a line between "difference of opinion, please tolerate mine", and bigotry. You've crossed it.

honestjohn Wrote:

"Statistics - I can prove anything by statistics - except the truth."
- George Canning

"General, abstract truth is the most precious of all blessings; without it man is blind, it is the eye of reason." - Rousseau

Has anyone noticed that as soon as an actual problematic person leaves, some others can't let that emotion go.  People are still posting about - Lucie - right now. That emotion and angst is being turned on people that perhaps should be given a chance to actually show who they are.  When people have to defend themselves, they look defensive.  Their words, just by replying "sound" emotional.

For all anyone REALLY knows, some posters aren't ABLE to think of everyone else's perspective- at least not right away - or when under stress.   Perhaps some people on here are in the spectrum? Perhaps all people need patience and understanding?

Have any of the more veteran AFFers changed and evolved and become more mellow and open-minded since coming on AFF.  I should think so.  I have seen it (in my opinion).  In this climate it is not fair to all.
It's like some are looking to find and fast, the next person to treat with quick judgements and with less tolerance than they themselves would be comfortable dealing with .  HOw well would any of us deal, whatver our supposed written or socail skills with such a barrage being thrown at them in a written forum?

Does everyone just want to find a new LC, or new L1?, Isn't there anything more positive to do? Is this a pattern?

I don't think it's fair to assume Illusion is being quickly and unfairly judged, or that it stems from a need to attack. If you're gay, you're going to have a strong reaction to the implication that you should be a lower class of citizen; if you're African-American, you're going to have a strong reaction to being told you're stupid but a good runner; if you're a liberal, you're going to have a strong reaction to being called a terrorist.

Considering the inflammatory nature of this little dictator's posts, I would say he has been accorded significantly more respect than he deserves.

honestjohn Wrote:

ocampo Wrote:

I'm sure you can reassure him of that in PM, atypical.

At least until he gets banned.

Which person, simen or illusion?
Are you asking if illusion Pm'd me? He did, yesterday, to talk about religion, his, mine, how many times I changed mine etc., an exchnage of thoughts and history.
Did I get Pm'd also about his opinion of whether or not he thinks I am thinking un-emotionally, yes. So?
AND, am I ALWAYS supportive of ANYONES right to give an opinion and have natural back and forth on this forum, yes.
Next time I'll respond in PM. I can't imagine what else to write here.

Atypical/HonestJohn, I would like your specific opinion on my point of view, because my impression is that you choose to remain neutral even when one party's ideas veer into the realm of bigotry and hate.

I will not argue Illusion's use of the word "deviant" as he applied it to homosexuality. I feel his backing away from what appeared to be a derogatory use of the word is disingenuos, but he gets the pass. I will argue his preference for a lower status of class for gays. Do you support that opinion, or consider it a reasonable point of view even if you disagree with it?

He mentioned that blacks are good runners. Do you consider that a reasonable and fair statement in modern society, or does it sound as blatantly racist to you as it does to me? Is racism an acceptable point of view?

He said blacks are proveably less in intelligent than other races? Do you agree with that, and, if you don't, is it a reasonable opinion in modern society?

I'm not being patronizing. I'm genuinely asking you to explore you're neutrality on this person's opinions, because I think there's a point at which neutrality is no longer reasonable.

honestjohn Wrote:

NYAJ asked atypcial this "He said blacks are proveably less in intelligent than other races? Do you agree with that, and, if you don't, is it a reasonable opinion in modern society?

I'm not being patronizing. I'm genuinely asking you to explore you're neutrality on this person's opinions, because I think there's a point at which neutrality is no longer reasonable."

I say again, who cares what my opinions on such an obscure subject are? I don't actually have opinions on this stuff. I don't give this very much thought. But, Joe lest you thought I on purpose left out the answer to the intelligent question....
Oh, do I Think that black people are less intelligent than people with any other skin color, yellow, res, white, tan, light brown? OF course not. Did someone on here say that? I don't know.
Are there statistics that measure IQ's on all continents. Some continents have more dark skin (hotter climates) and (less developed educational systems) Can people have read or seen statistics about IQ's? yes.
why ask me?

I care about your opinion, specifically because you are expressing neutrality - and encouraging others to practice it - towards someone I don't think you know much about. Illusion said all of the things I claim he did. How can you advise us about proper treatment of him if you didn't know that?

And what's with "why ask me?" Your opinion doesn't matter? This is an internet forum. Opinions and ideas are what we do here. Why wouldn't I care about yours?

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Mr.Max

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ocampo2

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