Aspies For Freedom

The new law being voted on soon in the UK, the Human Tissue and Embryology Bill, will mean that parents having IVF will not be allowed to keep embryos showing signs of disability. As I understand it, if there's reason to suspect the child will be autistic (or any other disability for that matter) the embryo gets to die.

What does that say about all of us here and what value they think we have to society?

I was going to post in detail on this but I feel it is a very touchy subject.

I'll just say there are some conditions out there with zero upsides. Not saying the Government has the right to choose this.

Until reading this thread I had disagreed with calling plans to eliminate autism a "Genocide." Now, I am willing to say it myself.

This is genocide.

earthmonkey Wrote:

I also fear not getting a choice in this. That is the problem with arguing that people who don't want a cure can simply refuse it as a matter of personal choice - any "cure" would be forced (and children whose parents refuse certainly taken away), though we probably won't even get to that point, because we'll be forced to get rid of our autistic progeny before birth, and even if it is not forced, we would be subject to the stares and whispers of people wondering, "Didn't they know there was a prenatal test for that?"

As far as pre-natal testing goes, It's probably more a matter of "medically pressured" than forced - but yeah, we're entering a disturbing time in autistic history...

GuessWho Wrote:

Peter Griffin comes to mind before he goes for the snip. Out pops Stewey who declares the world shall be his.

GuessWho Wrote:

Have fun and take a load off for a good cause. I am not responsible for choking on your morning coffee.

damn it GuessWho.
you owe me a new screen Big Grin

featherways Wrote:

I can see problems ahead for families who do go ahead with children with disabilities. Suppose the government says "Well, you chose it - you can pay for all the treatment, all the medical care, all the respite care, all the special education etc". It is in danger of creating even more of an "underclass" than we have now. At the top, there would presumably be the rich people who can engineer the perfect designer baby - intelligent, beautiful/handsome, fast, strong. And every one of them effectively a 'clone'. Gee, is this the society they really think they want? And if so, how does it differ from eugenics?

Welcome to Germany, 1939.
here, have a free train ticket!

/poor, oh so poor, taste.

Marcia Wrote:

I did a bioethics class this year at uni and there were a couple of German girls on the course. They said that Germany is extremely conservative on these matters, precisely because of their history. Scientists there who complain that they are lagging behind in terms of biotechnical advances are basically told either to concentrate on some other field os study, or go elsewhere.

can you honestly blame them?

Marcia Wrote:

pikajedi4 Wrote:

Marcia Wrote:

I did a bioethics class this year at uni and there were a couple of German girls on the course. They said that Germany is extremely conservative on these matters, precisely because of their history. Scientists there who complain that they are lagging behind in terms of biotechnical advances are basically told either to concentrate on some other field os study, or go elsewhere.

can you honestly blame them?

Nope, not at all! My only wish is that other countries would also learn those same lessons, not only in terms of biotechnology, but also the way we treat people in society as a whole. Hitler's rise to power and subsequent abhorent events were made possible by a society which for years had been encouraged to think of those who didn't fit in or match the ideal Aryan stereotype, as being in some way less than human. I think that's what happening now in the UK, particularly when you think about tabloid and political sound-bite comments on immigrants and people seeking asylum. Grrrr.....rant warning....rant warning....

You get the idea! Smile

the analogy stands;

we are now pushing a Eugenics bill, in essence. personally, I'm all for the hybrid idea, it would allow us to farm organs, and find treatments for diseases easier; however, the hidden bill within the bill is a major cause for concern, and is one that I dont think the tabloids have figured out yet. time will tell. how long until parents are in court for saying "go fuck yourself with a sledgehammer" to the govmt?

damnit, wrong button.

in any case, I personally sleep with a pair of swords by my bed (a Chokutō and a Bastard, if anyone cares). razor sharp, and will use them.

if it does get to a point of snatching aspies for "treatment", let them try Wink

pikajedi4 Wrote:

damnit, wrong button.

in any case, I personally sleep with a pair of swords by my bed (a Chokutō and a Bastard, if anyone cares). razor sharp, and will use them.

if it does get to a point of snatching aspies for "treatment", let them try Wink

I agree

I will keep my nails razor sharp for them! Wink the movie alien srpings to mind..

anyways is there a petition for this kind of thing out at the mo?

I would offer to make one but It'll porbably be flooded with spam

I will find the contact information for both the house of lords and buckingham palace then find and english based activist group. (if that is the word!) Tongue

found a list of contact info for the house of lords I think or other parts of the government

http://www.parliament.uk/directories/directories31.cfm

not sure if this will help but this is to send a E-mail to the queen

http://www.royal.gov.uk/output/page4835.asp#

if not there is also the letters

should we start making posters gareth?

hope the links help

featherways Wrote:

I've also just emailed the National Autistic Society to ask what they're going to be doing about this Bill. Will let you know if I ever get a response. I tried their press office, which might not be the right starting point but I bet they know who is.

shall I alert my local support group?

They are mainly Anti-cure

although that didn't stop them getting that arsehole raun kaufman over here >.<

O NOES!

<.<

am I the only one not getting my thong into a not?

Seriously the odds of this passing are slim to none. The MPs are not idiots, they will see the bill and go WTF? I mean seriously, ya'll are actiing like chicken little. The sky is not falling, not yet least. So everyone just cool it. The topic was "FAIL'D" when Nazi Germany was mentioned anyway.

FTR embryos die anyway in IVF, some get picked others don't that normally how it works. And if a supposed non-disabled embryo is picked, sometimes nature throws a curveball and in 9months you have a ASD baby. Who freakin' knows?

I am having a "House of the Scorpion" momenting....

The UK government would never be allowed to force abortions, but stopping a fertilised egg before its implanted is not seen as bad so theres a chance this bill will be voted in. I have a feeling its in relations to the Deaf couple that used IVF to get rid of any embryos in that weren't Deaf aswell. There is a whole Deaf community that see being deaf as a positive rarther than a negative, similar to how we see Autism. Deaf is used with a capital to diffenciante between having deafness and being Deaf.

http://www.deaf.com/

The government have decided to make a law to stop anyone in future delibrately causing a child to be "disabled". Which i can see their point, however the people making the decisions of what is a disability will not have first hand experience of them and therefore have no right to say it is something that should be stopped. I have listened to a few radio shows about this. The Deaf people's stand is that by making this law they are saying a Deaf person's life is worth less than someone who isn't Deaf which is not right or fair of them to say so.

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