Aspies For Freedom

What you are refering to is a "Molly Mormon". They are prejudice, racist, scum. I live in utah, and I hate those mormons that are so full of themselves.

I am babtised to the Mormon church (but I am not that much of a believer of the church anymore), and I know that only 40% of the mormon church (or less) is full of "Molly Mormons".

But lets try not to get off the subject.

What I got from the subject post: Aspies don't get the same job opportunities as most people do.

There are many reasons for this. One being that we aren't always that good with NT's (and sometimes, we aren't good with other Aspies either), and being a missionary requires you to talk with people and influence them. I know there are plenty of other reasons, but I'm brain farting at the moment o.o

Please, please don't bash people's faiths.  Just because there is a website about it, does not make it true.  Otherwise, you would have to believe  [url=htt p://w ww.auti smspea ks.org/]thi s.[/ url]

[edit] link broken [couldbecousin]

In case you hadn't noticed, there are websites about everything.  

Just to clarify, I'm a Mormon.  I have black friends, Chinese friends, and Mexican friends too.  One of these is Wiccan, one Catholic, and others are Atheists.  And many of these people are anything but rich and several are gay/lesbian/bisexual.  (I grew up with a gay boy, and he was my mother's favourite friend of mine.  She was just happy that I had friends at all).   

No, they just tortured people and executed them based on someone's accusation that they were a witch.  You could point out faults in other religions all day if you felt like it.

Unfortunately, just like in every religion, the members are not perfect.  People are people whether they are Christian or Pagan or Atheist or whatever, and there will be plenty of those that do not live what they claim to believe.

You don't have to be a Mormon.  I'm not even asking you to like Mormons.  Just please show some courtesy to people's faith.  Being a Mormon, or of any other faith, does not automatically make somebody racist or a homophobe.

And I have never, ever been taught that black people could not attain the same heaven that I could.

Anyway, on topic now.

Proud2LuvNAspie  I can definitely understand that you might be concerned about job opportunities for AS individuals, in the Mormon Church or out of it.  

But as far as the Church goes, I do have to say that I have been given more jobs than I wanted.  (I was a religious teacher for a year, and always had 30 pairs of eyes stuck on me for 45 minutes straight---I hated it, but never complained, so my situation never changed.  Then my roommate informed the bishop I had problems interacting with class members during my lessons.  Then they changed my job.  Now I get to make the programs for Church meetings.  I like organizing all the details each week.  )

I have to agree with sarahjoke about the whole wheel-chair thing too.  I can't imagine many AS people who would want to be a full-time missionary, and if they do want it, it is probably more because they feel it is expected of them.  That's why they have these special missions, so even people who can't serve a full-time mission can still know they have done all they can do and can be happy with that.

And, if he really feels he wants a job in the Church, he doesn't have to go on a mission to do it.  He can always ask one of the leaders to give him a job, and as long as they have any kind of job available, they would probably be happy to give it to him!  

Too bad that doesn't work for the rest of the world.  

I just realized that my other post could be taken the wrong way, so I just wanted to make sure I explained.

Max, I wasn't really angry or anything, just irritated I guess.  You're not the first person I've met who seems to have a grudge against Mormons, whether it's because of your own experience or just things you've read.  I felt the need to defend my religion, because there truly are a lot of good people there.  So it just doesn't feel very nice when you genuinely find something that makes you happy and other people tear it down.

Your entitled to your own opinions and beliefs, of course, so I won't tell you not to think that way, but I just don't think that the way you are expressing your dislike of Mormons was well placed.

So don't hate me because I'm Mormon, hate me because I'm annoying and long-winded.  

I guess it is foolish to think now this topic wont change off from mormon religion.

Even though it's natural for most aspies to notice the little details, the main picture that this topic was most probably made for was right near the bottom of the topic post: Aspie Job Opportunities.

lol, in my view religion only serves to give humanity morality. Without religion, we would all have to accept sciences facts that we are brutish, cruel and kill animal and the environment needlessly.

Religion gives humans the difference between right and wrong- that if we are good we will be rewarded in the next/after life. I am athiest and believe religion is wrong. But hey, I'm a pessimist.

"Now, correct treatment of one's fellow humans is a feature of all religions."

http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=0014-1828(198707)26%3A3%3C179%3ABUGEAS%3E2.0.CO%3B2-L

...Thus for the khali khane sacrifice to be effective, he must be first made into an appropriate offering...

http://www.apostatesofislam.com/media/handcutting.htm

... Then he said: Cut off his hand. So his (right) hand was cut off...

Showing some reality here.

Max, why would you try to convince this person to become racist and homophobic? Nokuthula obviously believes in a form of Mormonism that is not bigoted. Who cares what it says in the book?

Our best chance to truly topple the extreme religious right is going to come from people like him - tolerant religious people are a bigots worst nightmare.

Oh, BTW, I forgot to bring up the entire point of this thread...

The reason that AS/autistic people aren't sent on full missions is because they would be MISERABLE. Seriously, you have to be with your partner constantly, talk about your feelings to almost anyone, deal with people slamming doors in your faces... the guy was sent on a part-time mission so he would feel like he was doing something, without all the stress an Aspie would feel on a mission. If he HAD been in a position where he was obligated to go on a mission, all you people would be complaining that Mormons don't understand Aspies and are forcing them to do things they don't feel comfortable doing. Seriously.

There's two ways your debate with him can play out, as no-one is going to change their religion based on an online forum. He will either ignore you, or he will agree with your take on the book of Mormon and become bigoted.

If there is a movement within the Mormon church towards tolerance, it should be encouraged.

People choose their religion and denomination through a process of spiritual belief, rather than practicalities - They're as likely to change their religion as their denomination (i.e. not very).

If racial and sexual intolerance were the churches main teaching, then that would be a different story - for instance, if a person here belonged to the KKK's religion I'd be happy to attack them. With Mormons, it's a background teaching, and can be ignored.

I'd be the first to agree that the Mormons in general have a bad history of bigotry. All the more reason to encourage the few that don't.

It would be easy if all the bad people could stay in their nice little boxes. Unfortunately, it doesn't work that way.

The Book of Mormon never said anything against black people. I've read it cover to cover many, many times.

Joseph Smith's family never had any black servants or slaves.

The witch trials are constantly used by Mormons to defame other Christians? Since when? I have grown up with the teachings of Latter-Day Saints and not once have I been told that other Christian faiths were evil because of the witch trials.

Where are you hearing these things? Seriously, maybe you should consider actually listening to the doctrine itself before you attack it.

We're not brainwashed and deluded, either, we're encouraged (far more than what I've seen in many other religions) to get a testimony of our own and make our own decisions, not just follow what our parents say.

And I've never been taught that gay people are satanic, either.

Just one final word on the subject. Max, you've become the thing you're campaigning against. You're attributing characteristics to this person based on the group he belongs to, rather than the person he is.

I'd like this site to be free of racial, sexual, neurological and religious intolerance. Bigots like yourself make this almost impossible.

I'm a "she" actually.  Not that it matters in the context of your discussion.  Just fyi.

But thanks for sticking up for me EvilZakkie!    

And I apologize if it seemed I was trying to demonize other Christians when I mentioned the witch hunts, because that wasn't my intent at all.  I realize that that is a very unfortunate event, but I don't think it applies to the Christians today.  At least not the ones I've met.

Anyway, I'm not going to argue more over what the Book of Mormon says or doesn't say, because there's really no point in arguing it here.  In any case, I support neurodiversity and religious diversity.  And racial diversity.  And diversity of lots of other things too.  Diversity is good, I have no problem with diversity.

Anyway, I thought of something else.  SheWhoCan'tThinkOfAUsername or Proud2LuvNAspie, maybe you know the answer: are you sure he absolutely would not be allowed to serve a full-time mission if that's what he really wanted?  My cousin is on a mission right now, and I am pretty sure he is an Aspie.  Maybe he's not, but I know for sure his brothers are.

I know they wouldn't advise it, for the sake of his sanity, but is there an actual rule against it?  Because I've never really heard of it before . . .

Oops! Sorry about that - I should have checked your profile first... *smiles*

No probs.