This is a fantastic article - mentioning most of the right people. The reflection by Larry Arnold gives new light to the reason why he ended leaving the Autism Hub (Kevin Leitch's group). Larry seems to think we can assimilate into NT society - which is my translation of his opposition to "seperatism". For the most part, he is wrong - and I suspect Gareth knows that as well. Kev Leitch knows it to which is probably why he and Larry had a blazing row a little while back.
Also nice to see Amanda Baggs mentioned there as well!
Terrific stuff!
Nice! Probably one of the best Neurodiversity articles published to date. I especially liked your quote at the end, Gareth, and the things Simon Baron-Cohen said- I think he hit the nail on the head.
I think it's talking about the coverage your CNN story got, Anbuend. And it got heaps - you have to admit that!
Maybe AFF's position was slightly exaggerated, but I call that a good thing. It puts the truth of matters out there - and that by itself can never be exaggerated!
I'll just bump this up ahead of Max's post about the same subject!
Great article. I can't really say anything about it that hasn't already been said.
Also, it's surprising to hear that you're only 20, Gareth - that means you're my age (I'm also 20, 21 in December)! I thought you'd be a bit older to be able to handle a site like this, also the fact that you have a wife an son (mentioned by Amy in another thread) suggested to me that you were both around your 30's.
6000 is still a whole lot
And it's worldwide as well, not just in the UK.
Thanks for your article Gareth. It is encouraging to know that you are married. On the other hand, I probably encourage others by being fully independent living.
Seriously, I could have sworn Amy was around 35. And that you have three or so kids. How is that possible???
Mike, unfortunately that is not possible. That's why Kev blew up at him. Kev knows as I do that the AS community will never be able to get along unless all of our individual differences are taken into account. I know through experience how hard that is to achieve, so we prefer to "go it alone". The assimilation needs to be on our terms - not NT's. They can help but they have to understand what we are about and they think that they do, but they don't. Ultimately they can have nothing to do with the final result.
When it comes down to brass tacks, we Aspies can be very selfish - especially when provoked. I don't like it myself because I can be very selfish at times. But that's me, and I accept it about myself. It's the lack of acceptance that's the problem. It's very messy and really can only be cleaned up by leadership which - unfortunately HAS to come from the NT's.
I'm probably not making much sense here as I'm hurrying this a bit, but hopefully I'm getting the message across!
WOW. Great article Gareth! That is so amazing to see a real article that portrays AS and the movement correctly. Of mostly, though I didn't personally see anything too off balance. I had wondered what Baron-Cohen's attitudes were towards the autistic-rights movement, I'm glad to see that he is such a good guy... I had always placed him as such in my mind.
Mike, unfortunately that is not possible. That's why Kev blew up at him. Kev knows as I do that the AS community will never be able to get along unless all of our individual differences are taken into account. I know through experience how hard that is to achieve, so we prefer to "go it alone". The assimilation needs to be on our terms - not NT's. They can help but they have to understand what we are about and they think that they do, but they don't. Ultimately they can have nothing to do with the final result.
...
I'm probably not making much sense here as I'm hurrying this a bit, but hopefully I'm getting the message across!
Err...nope?
I'd be delighted if you'd have another try at explaining, though. This AS/NT debate seems really important.
Mike, unfortunately that is not possible. That's why Kev blew up at him. Kev knows as I do that the AS community will never be able to get along unless all of our individual differences are taken into account. I know through experience how hard that is to achieve, so we prefer to "go it alone". The assimilation needs to be on our terms - not NT's. They can help but they have to understand what we are about and they think that they do, but they don't. Ultimately they can have nothing to do with the final result.
...
I'm probably not making much sense here as I'm hurrying this a bit, but hopefully I'm getting the message across!
Err...nope?
I'd be delighted if you'd have another try at explaining, though. This AS/NT debate seems really important.
Hmm. Admitedly, I only ever read Kev, Joel and Amanda's accounts of the story, not Larry's, but this how I understood it:
1. Larry mistakenly called Kev an NT (he's not autistic, true, but he IS neurodivergent) and claimed that the autistic rights movement was being led by NTs, which, obviously, isn't how it should be.
2. After repeated atempts by both parties to clarify and right the misunderstanding, the whole thing devolved into a flame war across at least five different blogs.
3. Larry left the hub. The blogs quieted down after a while.
Although swathed in misunderstanding as it was, the whole row brought up a serious question about the movement: What place do non-autistics have within it?
I don't think anyone was advocating allowing the Hub, or the movement, to be totally led by NTs. However, some people beleived firmly that no NTs should be allowed to be a part of it at all, and a few people advocated only autistics, leaving out any other neurodivergent people (like Kev).
Personally, I beleive we need to walk a middle path. I would welcome any alliance with the Disability Rights movement at large, although I would not take kindly to any attempts they might make at leading or controling our movement. The direction of the autistic rights movement needs to come from autistics; NTs, cousins, and parents can and should join in, as they all have things to add that are important, but it needs to be led by autistics and consist mainly of, autistics.
OK obviously my point was missed (and it was my fault for rushing as well but I had good reason to) so I'll have to try again. But not right now - I'm not going to make the same mistake twice when I'm short on time!
I liked that it gave more than one perspective. Often the autistic community is portrayed as if we only have one.
Hello,
That is exactly the reason why I loved this article, so many different points of view .
Thanks for posting it!
Willis